What Soora 2:23 really says to SFE Talk?

Fuzzman

SFE Talk wrote:I am focused. I have proven that Sura 2:23 is unintelligible. You can't come up even with one objective criteria. In fact you have shown us a subjective criteria fro the challenge. You have fallen into my trap till its too late.

Hahahaha joker! Now how could Fuzzman have fallen in your trap when it is your butt that is stuck in it? I think it is you that had fallen into your own trap because when you dug the narrow hole, you forgot to accomodate the exit strategy for your fat ego. We wouldn't be on page six if you had been "focused" would  we?  Now you say my perception of the objective criteria is "subjective"! Fine. Read on below and I'll show the world that it is you that has been the subjective advocate all this while. I see you're game for wordplay eh? Eat this.

What means the word SUBJECTIVE and how it is related to SFE Talkie?
sub穓ec穞ive    Pronunciation Key  (sb-jktv)
adj.
sub穓ective穕y adv.
sub穓ective穘ess or subjec穞ivi穞y (sbjk-tv-t) n.
   1.
         1. Proceeding from or taking place in a person's mind rather than the external world: a subjective decision.
         2. Particular to a given person; personal: subjective experience.
   2. Moodily introspective.
   3. Existing only in the mind; illusory.
   4. Psychology. Existing only within the experiencer's mind.
   5. Medicine. Of, relating to, or designating a symptom or condition perceived by the patient and not by the examiner.
   6. Expressing or bringing into prominence the individuality of the artist or author.
   7. Grammar. Relating to or being the nominative case.
   8. Relating to the real nature of something; essential.

subjective
\Sub*jec"tive\, a. [L. subjectivus: cf. F. subjectif.] 1. Of or pertaining to a subject.
2. Especially, pertaining to, or derived from, one's own consciousness, in distinction from external observation; ralating to the mind, or intellectual world, in distinction from the outward or material excessively occupied with, or brooding over, one's own internal states.

SFE Talk is filled with emotions and allows his ego to cloak existing facts

What means the word OBJECTIVE and how is it related to Fuzzman?

ob穓ec穞ive    Pronunciation Key  (b-jktv)
adj.
   1. Of or having to do with a material object.
   2. Having actual existence or reality.
   3.
         1. Uninfluenced by emotions or personal prejudices: an objective critic.
         2. Based on observable phenomena; presented factually: an objective appraisal.
   4. Medicine. Indicating a symptom or condition perceived as a sign of disease by someone other than the person affected.
   5. Grammar.
         1. Of, relating to, or being the case of a noun or pronoun that serves as the object of a verb.
         2. Of or relating to a noun or pronoun used in this case.
n.
   1. Something that actually exists.
   2. Something worked toward or striven for; a goal. See Synonyms at intention.

Fuzzman applies facts taken from existing facts minus the emotions or spasms of egoism.

SO HOW DOES BEING OBJECTIVE AND SUBJECTIVE AFFECT THE CRITERIA OF THE 2:23?
Syn: Objective, Subjective.

Usage: Objective is applied to things exterior to the mind, and objects of its attention; subjective, to the operations of the mind itself. Hence, an objective motive is some outward thing awakening desire; a subjective motive is some internal feeling or propensity. Objective views are those governed by outward things; subjective views are produced or modified by internal feeling.

In the philosophy of mind, subjective denotes what is to be referred to the thinking subject, the ego; objective what belongs to the object of thought, the non-ego. --Sir. W. Hamilton

Final Analysis.
We can clearly see that SFE Talk is subjective towards the true objectivity of 2:23 by letting his ego get the better of him and that Fuzzman has been objective all this while because Fuzzman drives his strength from the reality of the 2:23 which is existing and not of Fuzzman's own psycho-analysis as seen done by SFE Talk.

As for my peception of the objective criteria of the 2:23, we'd all like to see your explaination of it being subjective. We're waiting and hopefully not until Hell freezes over, will you provide an answer that is intelligible and intelligent.

ARI FUZZMAN

[ Last edited by Fuzzman on 19-10-2003 at 10:12 AM ]

Fuzzman

Looks like SFE Talk is still stuck in the trap of his own design. He should  have been been more objective-oriented when digging his trap. Hahaahaha. So where is SFE Talkie's proof of my objective perception of the 2:23 being subjective in nature? Where? Where?

Sfe Talkie can never put down Fuzzman, no matter what and that is an objective fact!

ARI FUZZMAN

I am objective, thast why I am able to trap you and I'm gald you admit you have fallen into my trap. God for you.

I'll let you have another try. Come up with an objective criteria now.

cheers

Fuzzman

Originally posted by SFE talk at 2003-10-20 11:09 AM:
I am objective, thast why I am able to trap you and I'm gald you admit you have fallen into my trap. God for you. I'll let you have another try. Come up with an objective criteria now.  ...

Hahahaha, if you were truly that "objective" as you try "subjectively" to deceive here, you'd have by now shown me in parts or all where lies the points in my perception of the objective criteria of the 2:23 that has failed protrayal of the 2:23 as having a objective instruction. Come up with a intelligent response NOW. I'm STILL waiting.

ARI FUZZMAN

So where? Where is your objective criteria used for the Sura 2:23 challenge? Where? I'm all ready to take the challenge.

Fuzzman

SFe Talk wrote: So where? Where is your objective criteria used for the Sura 2:23 challenge? Where? I'm all ready to take the challenge.

HERE IT ISSSSS, MY PRECIOUSSSSSSSSS.....

THE CASE OF THE OBJECTIVE CRITERIA.
My perception of the objective criteria for the 2:23 is this :
" To create a chapter in similiarity to any chosen soora with the assistance of your helpers from your faith who are directly your witnesses if and when you are in doubt that the Quran was not from Allah but the creation of Prophet Mohammad."

Now all you need to do is to prove me wrong! Simple as that but so difficult on you. Anything else ? I'm still waiting.


YESSSSSS SSSSMEAGOL WILL BEEEEE WAITING FOR YOUR ANSWER PLEASEEEE...

ARI FUZZMAN

[ Last edited by Fuzzman on 22-10-2003 at 10:56 AM ]

Similarity in what sense? What are the objective criteria involved? In something that only Muslims can see but cannot explain?

Fuzzman

SFE Talk wrote:Similarity in what sense? What are the objective criteria involved? In something that only Muslims can see but cannot explain?

Knowing that you would be on the lookout for possible loopholes to ensure fast exit for your failures in addressing the 2:23, Fuzzman finds it suitable to replace the word similiarity with the replacement word likeness.The 2:23 has always been a verse that has full objectivity in its message to non-believers. It is your subjective thinking that has been downplaying the reality of the 2:23 to the point of self-subjective paranoia.

From now on Fuzzman will ONLY ACCEPT terminology and description of the words OBJECTIVE and SUBJECTIVE directly from a dictionary sense and evaluation of its usage in wordplay. Fuzzman will NOT accept your own concoction, perceptions, caricactures or nuances that run alternate to what is found in English dictionaries. So if you want to talk about implementation of these words [i.e. Objective ans Subjective] from now on make sure you apply only dictionary approved ones.

Back to the issue at hand as always accomodating your dysfunction. So the latest correction should read like this:-
My perception of the objective criteria for the 2:23 is this :
" To create a chapter in likeness to any chosen soora with the assistance of your helpers from your faith who are directly your witnesses if and when you are in doubt that the Quran was not from Allah but the creation of Prophet Mohammad."

This time quit stalling and start coming up with something more objective out of your subjective malaise.

ARI FUZZMAN

Thats right, there are obvious loopholes in the sura 2:23. Very big ones. Soo big that Muslims have no hope of manking it intellgible.
Its no wonder that you cannot even come up with one objective criteria.  

peace

Fuzzman

Originally posted by SFE talk at 2003-10-22 10:50 AM:
Thats right, there are obvious loopholes in the sura 2:23. Very big ones. Soo big that Muslims have no hope of manking it intellgible.
Its no wonder that you cannot even come up with one o ...

No wonder I'm having trouble conversing with you. It's either you don't read right or do not understand word arrangment. The loopholes I mentioned were meant for you and about you when you are stuck. Everybody here knows how manipulative you can get to be when you're stuck. And the only mechanism that would work in your favor as a escape chariot would be the search for loopholes that would serve your escape route.

ARI FUZZMAN

Enough of playing words games, where are your objective criteria for the challenge? I'm still waiting.

Fuzzman

Originally posted by SFE talk at 2003-10-22 11:08 AM:
Enough of playing words games, where are your objective criteria for the challenge? I'm still waiting.

Word games work to expose your lies on the false perceptions you create for the words objective and subjective. If you think you've had enough of wordplay, then by all means get on with proving my perception of the 2:23 as being wrong. Simple as that.

ARI FUZZMAN

Word games from you shows desperation.
You failed to come up with evebn one criteria for teh challenge.

cheers

Originally posted by SFE talk at 22-10-2003 11:15 AM:
Word games from you shows desperation.
You failed to come up with evebn one criteria for teh challenge.

cheers

You can't even spell your words properly already - shivering - a sign of emotional stress - not easy being 'rebuked' by Fuzz huh?.. heheh

Still no objective criteria from Muslims. Hahahahahahaha.....

cheers

Fuzzman

Originally posted by SFE talk at 2003-10-22 11:56 AM:
Still no objective criteria from Muslims. Hahahahahahaha.....cheers

Still no objective criteria you say? Hahaha ,then why in tarnations are you avoiding comment on my perception for a objective criteria for the 2:23? Why the refusal to outrightly say that Fuzzman has not come up with a true objective criteria reflective of the 2:23?

So take a good look here and make your final stand based on what you see:-
What 2:23 says :-
YUSUFALI: And if ye are in doubt as to what We have revealed from time to time to Our servant, then produce a Sura like thereunto; and call your witnesses or helpers (If there are any) besides Allah, if your (doubts) are true.
PICKTHAL: And if ye are in doubt concerning that which We reveal unto Our slave (Muhammad), then produce a surah of the like thereof, and call your witness beside Allah if ye are truthful.
SHAKIR: And if you are in doubt as to that which We have revealed to Our servant, then produce a chapter like it and call on your witnesses besides Allah if you are truthful.

And this is my perception on the objective criteria for the 2:23 which reads:-
" To create a chapter in similiarity to any chosen soora with the assistance of your helpers from your faith who are directly your witnesses if and when you are in doubt that the Quran was not from Allah but the creation of Prophet Mohammad."

My perception and the instruction of the 2:23 itself have elements suggestive of its merits based upon clear definations found in reputable English dictionaries while yours is based on self-evaluation without yard rule dictionarial published appraisals approved by a governing English language authority. Yours is made up in your own subjective and very biased suggestive modes biased only to your approval and not authoritarian.


Here everybody [with the exception of you, although it is knowingly false denial syndrome] knows that the 2:23 has the most clearest of all instructions that fall under the auspices of being objective in completion.

Then to accomodate your hypocrisy, Fuzzman even came up with Fuzzman's own perception of a objective criteria for the 2:23 to which you dare not even make strong comments against? So what's the point of this futile exercise of yours if you cannot even summon one ounce of confidence to even explain where Fuzzman went wrong, accompanied by strong facts.

I'm still waiting for your rebuttal on my perception of the 2:23. Come on SFE Talk, people are watching your charade here and I think it is not working to your advantage.

ARI FUZZMAN

Fuzzman

Come on Mr.SFE Talk, don't be making us wait on you now you hear? Can you or can't you show me that my objective criteria perception is correct or not? Maybe you need time to meditate some more to regain lost confidence. Just wave the white flag if you need some time-off. Would be just too glad to oblige you some. Cheers fella.

ARI FUZZMAN

Fuzzman

SFE Talk cannot win over the case of soora 2:23 through his argument of the soora not having a objective criteria. SFE Talk goes on to accuse the soora 2:23 of only having a subjective criteria to which he forgets to append clear proofs. He has even failed to proof Fuzzman wrong on the objective criteria perception forwarded by Fuzzman in perusal of SFE Talk's gross disagreement. Now we see with the onset of SFE Talk's silence and failed anticipated rebuttal, we learn that there is a limit to SFE Talk's free fall gibberish that we all have learned to accustomised ourselves to.

I'm still waiting on SFE Talk to response intelligibly. If he doesn't, then I take it that the he has no more doubt over the inlaying message found in soora 2:23.

ARI FUZZMAN

[ Last edited by Fuzzman on 24-10-2003 at 10:51 AM ]

Similar in what sense? Thats what we want to know. Where are the objective criteria?

Fuzzman

Originally posted by SFE talk at 2003-10-24 02:39 PM:
Similar in what sense? Thats what we want to know. Where are the objective criteria?

See that plane? Well that's you in a subjective description. You're in a fixed path of suggestive subjective  movement but are going nowhere because you deny the course of objective destination.

ARI FUZZMAN