This is Islam

ibnur

Sephiroth posted on 6-11-2014 11:34 AM
I usually don't bother with Moderators' comments but since you are participating in this discussio ...

i am saying that your post may contact fake and hoax.  People talking in a video does not show that it happens in Mosul.  Even they did it in London too.  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbnyqYd3W_0

Ini macam video Saiful keluar masuk lift lepas tu kata kena liwat.  Alahai....  senangnya buat dakwaan.  

zulkifleerahman

You claim I do not accept criticism when comes to Hinduism. For that, I have asked a few questions :-

Sape avoided your questions ni...again u tak paham my first post..mcm mana nak
Debate intelingently. I used the word Open Season ..tak paham? Lantak la u nak bedal
iSIS...da kata siang siang TONG kosong..turn out the clip pun fake!

U  accept criticism ??? Read post #3.. Thats from your own words.

Sephiroth

ibnur posted on 6-11-2014 11:54 AM
i am saying that your post may contact fake and hoax.  People talking in a video does not show tha ...

by Ibnur

i am saying that your post may contact fake and hoax.

The proper term here is "may CONTAIN"

Is that why you deducted almost 400 points? Because it MAY contain fake and hoax. PROOF IT THEN TALK. Otherwise, STOP WASTING MY TIME.

Sephiroth

zulkifleerahman posted on 6-11-2014 12:28 PM
Sape avoided your questions ni...again u tak paham my first post..mcm mana nak
Debate intelingent ...

Hmm ... I don't see the answers to my questions from the fisher monger's post ...

ibnur

Sephiroth posted on 6-11-2014 01:11 PM
by Ibnur

The proper term here is "may CONTAIN"

yes, it should be CONTAIN because my auto suggest was ON that time.

It is you who actually must prove that the video is authentic because you are one of those who believe it and posting it on the net.  I have shown you that the video may be fake as had already been proven on other videos before this.

Since you cannot prove that the video is actually from Mosul and even Jenan Musa too cannot prove the video is authentic, I assume it is fake.

ibnur

Sephiroth posted on 6-11-2014 11:34 AM
I usually don't bother with Moderators' comments but since you are participating in this discussio ...

Question here is :- Are you claiming that there is no Slavery in Islam? Or are you claiming that ISIS do not conduct or promote Slavery?

There is no slavery in Islam like the one depicted in the video in Islam.  Thats why I believe it is a staged video.

There is no trading on 'captives'.  People only pay money to free a captives.  And there is no sex slaves in Islam.  Because these are captives of a war, they do not required the aqad niqah with the wali or saksi.  The victors of a war will take the women as their wives.  And must do according to the law of Islam.  And there is no trading.  However, the captives relatives may come and pay some money for their release.  

Sephiroth

by Ibnur

There is no slavery in Islam like the one depicted in the video in Islam.  Thats why I believe it is a staged video.

You can deduct my points because you THINK it has hoax but you have no problem coming out with stupid statement like this?

IF there is no slavery like what been shown here, then WHAT FORM OF SLAVERY IS THERE IN ISLAM? Explain WITH VERSES.

Sephiroth

by Ibnur

I have shown you that the video may be fake as had already been proven on other videos before this.

You have shown NOTHING but bad attitude and abuse of moderators' power by deducting other people's points without proper cause. That is all.

You THINK the video is fake, then prove it. Otherwise, I will take the video as authentic - with its arabic characters who speaks arabic.

zulkifleerahman

Sephiroth posted on 6-11-2014 01:12 PM
Hmm ... I don't see the answers to my questions from the fisher monger's post ...

Susah kalau berforum dgn budak budak....
i choose not to answer your questions....
i enter this thread to correct your forum etiquette...thats all
the golden rule is ....be prepare to accept criticism..ini tidak
orang lain cocok about hinduism ...u suruh %#*^}## off ,
U punya thread u punya rule. Macam budak main guli ,tak suka
Suruh pergi main jauh jauh...tak serupa mentality budak budak?
you came with your gun blazing..branding people bastard etc...
(personally i dont give a shit..u dont know me and i dont know u)
when all i wrote was well .......see for yourself in my first post.
like i say....mentality budak budak.

ibnur

Sephiroth posted on 6-11-2014 02:28 PM
by Ibnur

You can mouse over the moderator's icon to know why your point were deducted.  Your type never change laaa.  Still and forever cursing people non stop.   And you still cannot prove the video is really from Mosul.  Not even all those media reporters.  Proof that you believe in lies only.


76.8. Dan mereka memberikan makanan yang disukainya kepada orang miskin, anak yatim dan orang yang ditawan

Dengan yang demikian, apabila kamu berjuang menentang orang-orang kafir (dalam peperangan jihad) maka pancunglah lehernya, sehingga apabila kamu dapat membunuh mereka dengan banyaknya (serta mengalahkannya) maka tawanlah (mana-mana yang hidup) dan ikatlah mereka dengan kukuhnya. Setelah selesai pertempuran itu maka (terserahlah kepada kamu) sama ada hendak memberi kebebasan (kepada orang-orang tawanan itu dengan tiada sebarang penebusnya) atau membebaskan mereka dengan mengambil penebusnya. (Bertindaklah demikian terhadap golongan kafir yang menceroboh) sehinggalah berakhir peperangan jihad itu (dan lenyaplah sebab-sebab yang menimbulkannya). Demikianlah (diperintahkan kamu melakukannya). Dan sekiranya Allah menghendaki, tentulah Dia membinasakan mereka (dengan tidak payah kamu memeranginya); tetapi (diperintahkan kamu berbuat demikian) kerana hendak menguji kesabaran kamu menentang golongan yang kufur ingkar (yang mencerobohi kamu). Dan orang-orang yang telah berjuang serta gugur syahid pada jalan Allah (mempertahankan ugamanya), maka Allah tidak sekali kali akan mensia-siakan amal-amal mereka." (Surah Muhammad:4)

Telah dilaporkan melalui Umayr Abu 'Aziz ibn', adik Umayr Mus'ab ibn ', bahawa dia berkata, "Saya adalah antara tawanan perang pada hari peperangan Badar lalu Nabi berkata," Jadi baik kepada tawanan "dan kemudian Abu 'Aziz terus menyampaikan bahawa dia telah ditahan dan kekal dengan sekumpulan orang-orang Ansar dan bila-bila masa makan tengah hari atau makan malam datang, mereka akan berkhidmat kepadanya tarikh semasa mereka makan gandum mematuhi nasihat Nabi daripada merawat tawanan dengan kebaikan.

Truth.8

zulkifleerahman posted on 6-11-2014 05:24 PM

.u suruh %#*^}## off ,

itu bahasa    german...

zulkifleerahman

You have shown NOTHING but bad attitude and abuse of moderators' power by deducting other people's points without proper cause. That is all.

You mean to tell me ..u keep track of your points?
May i asked ...does that make u happy.? 1000 pts ,4799pts etc.?
What is actually u gain ni....tak pe  mari abang kasi pts..berapa nak?

sam1528

Sephiroth posted on 6-11-2014 11:46 AM
Talk like a fishmonger.

I will rephase the questions you have avoided from post #12

You claim I do not accept criticism when comes to Hinduism. For that, I have asked a few questions :-

Does Hindus practice slavery in the Past and Present?
Which race have been enslaved by the Hindus (in the past or present)?
Does Hinduism promote Slavery?

The answer is yes. Slavery is part of Hinduism in the form of the Caste System. However there is no ownership of people but the lesser are subjugates of the upper class.

Slavery is a stratification system in which some people are regarded as the property of others

The caste system is a stratification system based on Hindu religious beliefs , in which an individual's position is fixed at birth and cannot be changed

(page 395)

Modern slavery is alive and well in India :

Slavery is still alive and well in India. The country is estimated to have  several million modern day slaves thanks to its structured caste system, which can be taken advantage of by the powerful and the dominant.

Professor Bernardo A. Michael from Messiah College, Pennsylvania, US who teaches South Asian history told the Global Times, "Caste continues to remain a key ingredient in the emergence of new social patterns in India. It continues to be a source of inequality and exploitation."

Wait .... there is more. There is also another form of slavery in Hinduism entwined with its culture/tradition. It is 'sacred' sex slavery.

It is a tradition as old as India itself - lowly, village girls from "untouchable" families being dedicated to serve as temple prostitutes for Hindu high priests and Brahmin elders.

Dalit girls as young as 10 forgo conventional marriage to a single man in exchange for a life of service to the local deity, performing rituals and puja (prayers) for their village.

At puberty they are "married" to the temple amid ritual and celebration before spending their "wedding night" with the priest or upper-caste elder - a prelude to a life of sexual slavery.

You can count yourself lucky to be amongst muslims. Who knows , you could have been a temple prostitute if you are in India , being the Hindu extremist you are. You are OK with such.... all for the glory of Hinduism

Sephiroth

by zulkifleerahman  

i choose not to answer your questions....

Then I choose NOT to entertain you.

I'm not your servant to stand and listen to your garbage about some 7th century political ideology called Islam while keeping my mouth shut. That is not talking. IF Muslims thinking "talking" means only Muslims will talk and the rest must listen, then they are bigger FOOLS than I imagine.

Sephiroth

by Sam1528

Slavery is part of Hinduism in the form of the Caste System. However there is no ownership of people but the lesser are subjugates of the upper class.

There is no such thing as "sacred sex slave" in Hinduism. No practice of such things occurs within the Vedas or the Puranas, so how can one say this belongs to Hinduism?

FYI - Hindu sages like Mahatma Gandhi, Swami Vivekanda and many more had fought AGAINST Caste System and many more still does to this day. WHY? Cos the Caste System still followed today are based on BRITISH DIVIDE AND RULE POLICY. British made Caste System, not Hindu made caste system. Know the history before talking.

Who are the ones who continued to promote this British made Caste System? Modern day Congress. IF you want to see changes in India in term of Caste, just wait for few more years now that BJP is in power.

Then again, compare to Islam where women are sold like cattle, sheep and camels, this Caste System is much better. Islam did not change for the past 1,400 years and it will remain unchanged till its destruction (VERY SOON).

sam1528

Sephiroth posted on 7-11-2014 08:42 AM
There is no such thing as "sacred sex slave" in Hinduism. No practice of such things occurs within the Vedas or the Puranas, so how can one say this belongs to Hinduism?

FYI - Hindu sages like Mahatma Gandhi, Swami Vivekanda and many more had fought AGAINST Caste System and many more still does to this day. WHY? Cos the Caste System still followed today are based on BRITISH DIVIDE AND RULE POLICY. British made Caste System, not Hindu made caste system. Know the history before talking.

Who are the ones who continued to promote this British made Caste System? Modern day Congress. IF you want to see changes in India in term of Caste, just wait for few more years now that BJP is in power.

Then again, compare to Islam where women are sold like cattle, sheep and camels, this Caste System is much better. Islam did not change for the past 1,400 years and it will remain unchanged till its destruction (VERY SOON).

There is no 'sacred sex slave' in Hinduism? Why their presence in the Hindu temples mainly in South India? You are in denial because this is something that embarrass the hell out of you. I very sure you know of the Devadasi System :

Devadasi system is a religious practice in parts of southern India, including Andhra Pradesh, whereby parents marry a daughter to a deity or a temple.The marriage usually occurs before the girl reaches puberty and requires the girl to become a prostitute for upper-caste community members. Such girls are known as jogini. They are forbidden to enter into a real marriage

Lets look at some of the verses in your scriptures :

(1) Rig Veda 8:XIX:36 A gift of fifty female slaves hath Trasadasyu given me, Purukutsa's son,Most liberal, kind, lord of the brave.

(2) Mahabharata 1CXXII And he of eyes like lotus-petals also gave unto them a thousand damsels well-skilled in assisting at bathing and at drinking, young in years and virgins all before their first-season, well-attired and of excellent complexion, each wearing a hundred pieces of gold around her neck, of skins perfectly polished, decked with every ornament, and well-skilled in every kind of personal service

(3)Laws of Manu 8:413. But a Sudra, whether bought or unbought, he may compel to do servile work; for he was created by the Self-existent (Svayambhu) to be the slave of a Brahmana.
414. A Sudra, though emancipated by his master, is not released from servitude; since that is innate in him, who can set him free from it?

LOL , now you are going to tell me that you only follow the Baghavad Gita? You are just so full of it.

Where is your evidence that Islam allows slavery or sex slavery? So far all you have provided are just your unlearned opinion or your ignorance. Where is your evidence? Oh yeah .... you have none but just trying to shout the loudest in a belief that shouting aloud makes your argument factual. This is what we call farting thru your mouth.

I have the evidence to argue against you. The response by Prof Bernard Freamon :

In a recent article in its online English-language magazine, ISIS ideologues offered legal justifications for the enslavement of these non-Muslim non-combatants, stating that “enslaving the families of the kuffar [infidels] and taking their women as concubines is a firmly established aspect of the Shariah or Islamic law.”

The article argues, based on a variety of Shariah sources, that ISIS partisans have a religious duty to kill or enslave members of the Yazidi community as part of their struggle [jihad] against their enemies.

This argument is plainly wrong, hypocritical and astonishingly ahistorical, relying on male fantasies inspired by stories from the days of imperial Islam.

.... the emphasis in all of the revelations on slavery is on the emancipation of slaves, not on their capture or the continuation of the institution of slavery. (See, for example, verses 2:177, 4:25, 4:92, 5:89, 14:31, 24:33, 58:3, 90:1-12.)

There is not one single verse suggesting that the practice should continue. Further, the Quran makes no mention of slave-markets or slave-trading and it repeatedly exhorts believers to free their slaves as an exemplification of their piety and belief in God.

Perhaps the best example of this emancipatory ethic is chapter 90, which is explicitly addressed to the Prophet Muhammad. It posits that there are two roads one can take in life and that the “high road” is the one that leads the righteous human being to free slaves.

Dey meenachi , the caste system was already institutionalize before the British conqured India. Trying to weasel your way out huh?

LOL , you will not come up with anything substantial to refute me. However you would start to curse and swear which mirrors your upbringing. Like I stated , you can thank your lucky stars that you are amongst muslims. Else you would probably be a temple prostitute by now if you are in India.

Sephiroth

by Sam1528

Why their presence in the Hindu temples mainly in South India?

Are they any "sex slaves" in hindu temples in Malaysia? Or Singapore? Or UK or USA? Or any other parts of the World besides South India? IF NO, then how do you say that this is related to Hinduism?

FYI - India is a secular nation, run by pigs, dogs and prostitutes in Congress. In India, prostitution is legal in one part of the country (like Mumbai and Delhi) while illegal in another (like South India). Therefore India is not a model country for Hinduism, not yet anyway.

LOL , now you are going to tell me that you only follow the Baghavad Gita? You are just so full of it.

Yes, Hindus should only follow Bhavagad Gita as it was meant for everyone (in Hindu society). Vedas already OUTDATED even by Brahmin standards as many of its teachings (like worship of Indra) is no longer practise anywhere.

But then again, there is still verses in Islam which states how to buy, sell and treat your slaves, which are followed by devoted and true followers of Islam like ISIS.

Where is your evidence that Islam allows slavery or sex slavery?

Let's see : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_views_on_slavery

In Islamic law, the topic of slavery is covered at great length.[1] The Quran (the holy book) and the hadith (the sayings of Muhammad) see slavery as an exceptional condition that can be entered into under certain limited circumstances.[2] Only children of slaves or non-Muslim prisoners of war could become slaves, never a freeborn Muslim.[3] They also consider manumission of a slave to be one of many meritorious deeds available for the expiation of sins.[4] According to Sharia, slaves are considered human beings and possessed some rights on the basis of their humanity. In addition, a Muslim slave is equal to a Muslim freeman in religious issues and superior to the free non-Muslim.[5]

This shows that there are laws about Slavery in Islamic laws. IF Islam prohibit slavery like you said, then why should there be any laws regarding how to treat slaves?

The Arab slave trade was most active in West Asia, North Africa, and Southeast Africa. In the early 20th century (post World War I), slavery was gradually outlawed and suppressed in Muslim lands, largely due to pressure exerted by Western nations such as Britain and France.[2] For example, Saudi Arabia and Yemen only abolished slavery in 1962 under pressure from Britain; Oman followed suit in 1970, and Mauritania in 1905, 1981, and again in August 2007.[11] However, slavery claiming the sanction of Islam is documented presently in the predominately Islamic countries of Chad, Mauritania, Niger, Mali, and Sudan.[12][13]

This shows that Slavery is very much alive until end of World War 2 (about 70 years ago). Furthermore, it is done due to pressure from the West instead of out of their own free will to change. Therefore, it is possible many Muslims could continue to habor desire to own and keep slaves even to this day.

The so-called claims (by foolish Muslims here in Malaysia) that Muhammad had abolished slavery is nonsense. Muhammad didn't abolish slavery, he merely stated Muslims can only make slaves from non-Muslims - which is what ISIS are doing. In their eyes, those who do not follow their school of Islam (Sunnis if not mistaken) are not Muslims (which include Shiites) and therefore, can be made slaves.

The Quran includes multiple references to slaves, slave women, slave concubinage, and the freeing of slaves. It accepts the institution of slavery. It may be noted that the word 'abd' (slave) is rarely used, being more commonly replaced by some periphrasis such as ma malakat aymanukum ("that which your right hands own").

Do you recognise this word - "That which your right hands own" - which is what they said in the video, referring to their captured "slaves" whom they treat like animals and sold off like their properties. And you are saying they do not follow Islam. It is YOU who are not following Islam.

the caste system was already institutionalize before the British conqured India.

By Muslims - Yes.
British didn't invent the Caste System, they merely borrowed it from The Mughals who divided the population between Faithful and Non-Faithful and then labelled them with various other labels as well. Part of this population includes the so-called Brahmins who were busy kissing the rear-end of Moghul rulers at that time.

sam1528

Sephiroth posted on 7-11-2014 01:19 PM

Are they any "sex slaves" in hindu temples in Malaysia? Or Singapore? Or UK or USA? Or any other parts of the World besides South India? IF NO, then how do you say that this is related to Hinduism?

FYI - India is a secular nation, run by pigs, dogs and prostitutes in Congress. In India, prostitution is legal in one part of the country (like Mumbai and Delhi) while illegal in another (like South India). Therefore India is not a model country for Hinduism, not yet anyway.

For sure 'sacred sex slavery' is related to Hinduism. You don't see such in Malaysia , USA etc because the laws of the land prohibit it. In South India where it is a bit lax , people practice it because it is a requirement in the tradition of Hinduism. You are in delusional denial because you are trying your best to argue out of this fact to a point of you being disingenuous.

It doesn't matter if India is a secular country. The manuscripts of Hinduism is in support of slavery and also sex slavery. This is where you have a problem.

Yes, Hindus should only follow Bhavagad Gita as it was meant for everyone (in Hindu society). Vedas already OUTDATED even by Brahmin standards as many of its teachings (like worship of Indra) is no longer practise anywhere.

But then again, there is still verses in Islam which states how to buy, sell and treat your slaves, which are followed by devoted and true followers of Islam like ISIS.

LOL , when you are in trouble , you try to narrow down your manuscript to only the Bahagavad Gita and now claim that the Vedas is outdated. Yet most Hindus claim the Vedas to be the main (not main main) book and is the word(s) of your Hindu Gods. Are you admitting that the your Gods are also outdated with you outdating the Vedas? You are just full of it , aren't you?

Ha ha , verses in Quran on how to buy , sell and treat your slaves? Ok then pinpoint as to where in the Quran that states on how to buy and sell slaves? You are again farting thru your mouth.

Yes the Quran has verses about slaves but for the emancipation of slaves , per the link I posted :

First, consistent with the new ethic, the emphasis in all of the revelations on slavery is on the emancipation of slaves, not on their capture or the continuation of the institution of slavery. (See, for example, verses 2:177, 4:25, 4:92, 5:89, 14:31, 24:33, 58:3, 90:1-12.)

I am am still waiting for evidence from you using your religious scripture to prove me wrong. I provided the Quranic verses that states for the emancipation of slaves , the opposite of what you are claiming.

Let's see : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_views_on_slavery

    In Islamic law, the topic of slavery is covered at great length.[1] The Quran (the holy book) and the hadith (the sayings of Muhammad) see slavery as an exceptional condition that can be entered into under certain limited circumstances.[2] Only children of slaves or non-Muslim prisoners of war could become slaves, never a freeborn Muslim.[3] They also consider manumission of a slave to be one of many meritorious deeds available for the expiation of sins.[4] According to Sharia, slaves are considered human beings and possessed some rights on the basis of their humanity. In addition, a Muslim slave is equal to a Muslim freeman in religious issues and superior to the free non-Muslim.[5]


This shows that there are laws about Slavery in Islamic laws. IF Islam prohibit slavery like you said, then why should there be any laws regarding how to treat slaves?

Did you read what you posted? Oops , it should be did you understand what you posted? From the link I posted :

There is only one Quranic verse, 47:4, that authorizes capture of prisoners of war and it does not permit slavery, ordering military commanders to either free the prisoners gratis or hold them for ransom.

You are just arguing blind. In reality you do not even know what is in the Quran but arguing from your emotions being a Hindu extremist and supremicist. People like you are just full of hatred up to a point that you are detached from reality. LOL , that is what you are.

    The Arab slave trade was most active in West Asia, North Africa, and Southeast Africa. In the early 20th century (post World War I), slavery was gradually outlawed and suppressed in Muslim lands, largely due to pressure exerted by Western nations such as Britain and France.[2] For example, Saudi Arabia and Yemen only abolished slavery in 1962 under pressure from Britain; Oman followed suit in 1970, and Mauritania in 1905, 1981, and again in August 2007.[11] However, slavery claiming the sanction of Islam is documented presently in the predominately Islamic countries of Chad, Mauritania, Niger, Mali, and Sudan.[12][13]


This shows that Slavery is very much alive until end of World War 2 (about 70 years ago). Furthermore, it is done due to pressure from the West instead of out of their own free will to change. Therefore, it is possible many Muslims could continue to habor desire to own and keep slaves even to this day.

So easy to respond as Prof Bernard Freamon has addressed this :

Perhaps the best example of this emancipatory ethic is chapter 90, which is explicitly addressed to the Prophet Muhammad. It posits that there are two roads one can take in life and that the “high road” is the one that leads the righteous human being to free slaves.

The Prophet followed this exhortation, exhibiting a great solicitude for the material and spiritual condition of the slaves in the society around him. His example inspired his companions to emancipate thousands of slaves and, in an oft-quoted statement, he remarked that he would meet the man who “sells a free man as a slave and devours his price” on Judgment Day.

Many forget that, for hundreds of years, Muslim imperialists and slave-traders illegally raided non-combatant villages in Eastern Europe, West Africa, East Africa, India and Southeast Asia, plundering, pillaging and capturing and raping women and children with impunity under pretextual jihads.

It seems that the ISIS ideologues want to revive this shameful legacy.

Traditionalist interpreters conclude that slavery is lawful in Islam simply because there is Quranic legislation regulating it, suggesting an implied permission.

Even the traditionalists must acknowledge, however, that all of the Quranic verses on slavery arise in contexts that overwhelmingly encourage emancipation.

Why is this? It is because the Quranic intendment contemplated a gradual disappearance of chattel slavery.

This is exactly what has happened in history.

Again , you have been easily refuted. My question again , where in the Quran that states how to buy and sell slaves per your claim? I forsee you running away from this one.

The so-called claims (by foolish Muslims here in Malaysia) that Muhammad had abolished slavery is nonsense. Muhammad didn't abolish slavery, he merely stated Muslims can only make slaves from non-Muslims - which is what ISIS are doing. In their eyes, those who do not follow their school of Islam (Sunnis if not mistaken) are not Muslims (which include Shiites) and therefore, can be made slaves.

    The Quran includes multiple references to slaves, slave women, slave concubinage, and the freeing of slaves. It accepts the institution of slavery. It may be noted that the word 'abd' (slave) is rarely used, being more commonly replaced by some periphrasis such as ma malakat aymanukum ("that which your right hands own").

Do you recognise this word - "That which your right hands own" - which is what they said in the video, referring to their captured "slaves" whom they treat like animals and sold off like their properties. And you are saying they do not follow Islam. It is YOU who are not following Islam.

Nobody claim that Prophet Muhammad(saw) abolished slavery. He set the undertone for the abolishment of slavery over the years.

Where in the Quran that states that only non muslims can be made slaves? Can you pinpoint such verse to me. You are a again arguing from your rear end.

Can you now show me what mechanism makes IS or ISIS being true followers of the Quran? Your argument is the argument of a crazy person. You are not arguing with facts.

The phrase 'your right hands own' in context is that the Quran accept the fact of chattel slavery being a fact of life during the time of revelation. That is why the numerous verses about emancipation of slaves. Ha ha , you don't seem to use your brains at all.

By Muslims - Yes.
British didn't invent the Caste System, they merely borrowed it from The Mughals who divided the population between Faithful and Non-Faithful and then labelled them with various other labels as well. Part of this population includes the so-called Brahmins who were busy kissing the rear-end of Moghul rulers at that time.

Another BS from you. The caste system was institutionalized even before the Mughals. It is as old as Hinduism itself. Why are you trying to lie in order to weasel your way out? The caste system is nothing but institutionalized slavery and till today it is revered together with the 'sacred sex slavery' being part of Hinduism.

Can you now refute me with facts and verses from the Quran that you claim is in support of slavery, ie. how to buy and sell slaves.

LOL , let see how good you are with factual arguments.

ibnur

@Sephiroth using wikipedia as reference on everything he wants to debate.  Thats where his confusion begins.

zulkifleerahman

Sephiroth posted on 7-11-2014 08:29 AM
by zulkifleerahman  

Then I choose NOT to entertain you.

On the contrary...you did entertain me.i had a good
laugh at your silliness..