THROUGH THE COMFORTER, WHO ARE THE REAL JEWS IN THE EYES OF GOD?

Originally posted by Debmey at 2005-3-1 09:08 AM:
Thanks Kennkid.
So is allah a man just because 'he' was used to refer to allah?

In Islam, all souls are created beings. Souls have no gender. The gender part is the physical in this world. In the physical world, where the soul needs a physical body, it needs a gender to perform its role that God has ordained.

Allah is The Creator of the soul. He is above everything else. He needs no gender, the same as He needs no physical body. Jesus has a physical body and a  gender. Therefore he cannot be God.

The term 'HE' is used for Allah because it is unbecoming & not fitting for us to refer to The Creator as 'It' which would denote an inanimate object or an animal, or   'She" which would denote femininity. The English language is such. In the Malay language, for example, no gender is attached to 'Dia'.

In actual fact ALLAH is a unique name & a perfect name which does not denote any gender.

God, in the English language denotes gender because in paganism there is such a thing as goddess (a female god). Again, like 'He', 'God' is used in the translations of the bible and the holy Qur'an so that The Creator would not be thought as being feminine.

[ Last edited by KENNKID on 1-3-2005 at 11:01 AM ]

Debmey

Good for you Kennkid, you just answered Fuzzman.

Originally posted by Debmey at 2005-3-1 04:04 PM:
Good for you Kennkid, you just answered Fuzzman.

I think Fuzzman is very clear about what he understands. The clarification was meant for you and your tail.

Debmey

Thanks for helping me out Kennkid. Fuzzy was just too dumb to try this in the first place. I bet yu he has never read the Quran before.

peace

Originally posted by Debmey at 2005-3-1 05:27 PM:
Thanks for helping me out Kennkid. Fuzzy was just too dumb to try this in the first place. I bet yu he has never read the Quran before.

peace

Don't try to put me and Fuzzman at loggerheads. I wasn't helping you out. If you consider me clarifying to you that Jesus was never God and will never be God as helping you out than I'm glad you have learned something.

[ Last edited by KENNKID on 1-3-2005 at 05:49 PM ]

Fuzzman

Originally posted by Debmey at 2005-3-1 09:08 AM:
Thanks Kennkid. So is allah a man just because 'he' was used to refer to allah?

OK education time for the confused People of the Old School. As  for my brothers and sisters, please take note, so that you may be able to answer people who are confused about the non-genderised Allah.

If you were aware of little Arabic you would notice the below facts in that the Arabic word 'Allah' has no gender. The Arabic grammar has only two genders, male and female and male gender is of two types:
1. Masculine Haqeeqi i.e. Real, which is used to denote the masculine gender in humans, animals.
2. Masculine Majazi i.e. Unreal, wherein it is used as Masculine but in reality it is not so e.g. (Angels) Malak, Layl (Night), Bab (door). The word Allah , too falls in the second category i.e. Masculine Majazi.

The English language has got three genders; male, female and neutral. So if we translate the Arabic word 'huwa' into English, it can be translated as 'he' or 'it'. And the Arabic word 'hiya' can be translated as 'she' or 'it'.

Allah is unique and cannot be referred as 'it' in English, since Allah has no gender, neither male nor female or neutral. Some people may argue that the Arabic word 'huwa' and 'hiya' both can be used for 'it' or neutral gender, then why Allah has used 'huwa' and not 'hiya' ?

In Arabic grammar there are certain rules and criteria for feminine gender. First, if it is female by nature, like the word mother (ummum), it becomes feminine in gender. Allah is not a female. Second, if it ends with the third Arabic letter 'ta' like 'mirwahtun' (fan), it becomes feminine. The Arabic word 'Allah' doesn't end with 'ta' so it cannot be feminine. Third, if the word ends with 'Alif Mamduda' (big Alif), it becomes feminine. But the Arabic word 'Allah' doesn't end with 'Alif Mamduda' so, it cannot be feminine. And lastly, if the object occurs in pairs, like pairs of the body, e.g. 'Ainun' (eyes), 'yadun' (hands), they are considered feminine.
But Allah says in the Qur'an in Surah Ikhlas, chapter 112,
Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;
Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;
And there is none like unto Him.

So Allah is one and not a pair. Therefore, by default since it cannot be used as 'Hiya' i.e. she or it, Allah uses huwa i.e. He.

We therefore can see the true distinctions of the usage of HE for Allah and this paints a very clear understanding of the working mechanisms of the application of the gender word of HE, HIM or HIS in translation text.

Fuzzman would like to see how Debmey  would rebuke what Fuzzman has put up here or maybe go on ahead by telling Fuzzman the gender of the Holy Spirit mentioned as a HE?

ARI FUZZMAN

lolipop9

Peace..

Allah literally means THE GOD. It is a combination of two words, to wit:

Al (the) + ilah (God/Divinity) = Allah, THE GOD

Ilah is not definite. It can be made plural/feminine, so, when referring to the ONE GOD, the Qu'ran says Al+ilah, which is conjugated into Allah.

Peace

Debmey

Since He is used for Allah, does that mean allah is a man?

Originally posted by Fuzzman at 2005-3-1 08:05 PM:

OK education time for the confused People of the Old School. As  for my brothers and sisters, please take note, so that you may be able to answer people w ...

Thank you for the explanation Fuzzman. Very clear.

Originally posted by Debmey at 2005-3-1 09:24 PM:
Since He is used for Allah, does that mean allah is a man?

Use your brains Debmey. The He in the Quranic translations have not been used to denote a man. Why would Muslims purposely contradict Islam and what it stands for when translating the Qur'an? In Islam, no man, no woman (no human being) can be The Creator.

I guess that is the pre- kindergarten logic that you christians use to justify the usage of 'He' for God in your bible (which are all translations) when grooming (misleading , rather) your adherents in order for them to believe that Jesus  is your god huh?  

"Look here kids, listen to me debdeb your preacher here, God is a 'he' in the bible and  'he' means god is a man. Jesus is a he too and he is a man --- therefore  he sure is our god, no doubt about it." :lol



[ Last edited by KENNKID on 1-3-2005 at 11:03 PM ]

Debmey

Thanks to both Fuzzy and Kenny. They both debunked Fuzzy's question.

peace

Fuzzman

Originally posted by Debmey at 2005-3-2 12:25 AM:
Thanks to both Fuzzy and Kenny. They both debunked Fuzzy's question. peace

Debunked what? About you not knowing who your promised Comforter is? About you not knowing the what the "HE" in the promised Comforter was meant to be?

ARI FUZZMAN

Debmey

The comforter is the Holy Spirit.

John 14:26
But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

greekgod

Originally posted by Debmey at 2-3-2005 04:06 AM:
The comforter is the Holy Spirit.

John 14:26
But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have ...

I always want to say something, when somebody uses that verse.

How can the comforter be holy spirit.

The verse clearly promised a comforter who has the ability to hear, and speak, wherefore both of these are physical where people can be attended as if we are talking to another person.

Besides, Jesus said the father will send another after him, only if he (jesus) went (to where?)... Simply mean, that the comforter should also be the same physical as Jesus.

Dont you guys think that the verse had later been added with term "Holy Ghost"? Because if we remove that Holy Ghost, the verse will clearly be *clear* (in term of the upcoming of somebody who can listen and speak - or in other word *reply*)

Debmey

The Holy Spirit can hear and speak.

The Holy Spirit was to be sent to Jesus' disciples, Mo was never mentioned nor did Mo show up to them.

So how can the Comforter be Mo?

greekgod

Originally posted by Debmey at 2-3-2005 06:16 AM:
The Holy Spirit can hear and speak.

The Holy Spirit was to be sent to Jesus' disciples, Mo was never mentioned nor did Mo show up to them.

So how can the Comforter be Mo?

Funny!

Show me the verse in any synoptic gospels that Holy Ghost have been into meeting with his disciples after he (jesus) went away!

what is the form of holy ghost?

he supposed to be able to be seen and touchable like jesus, wherefore, other people, not only the disciples, be able to meet with!

give me some concrete example, that holy spoke to anyone after the went-away jesus from his disciples!

Originally posted by greekgod at 2-3-2005 12:11 PM:


I always want to say something, when somebody uses that verse.

How can the comforter be holy spirit.

The verse clearly promised a comforter who has the ability to hear, and speak, wherefore both of these are physical where people can be attended as if we are talking to another person.

Besides, Jesus said the father will send another after him, only if he (jesus) went (to where?)... Simply mean, that the comforter should also be the same physical as Jesus.

Dont you guys think that the verse had later been added with term "Holy Ghost"? Because if we remove that Holy Ghost, the verse will clearly be *clear* (in term of the upcoming of somebody who can listen and speak - or in other word *reply*)

John 14:26
But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.


did muhammad remind people of what jesus said?

jesus never said he was a prophet but muhammad said jesus was.
jesus said love your enemy but muhammad said kill your enemy if you have to.
jesus said fasting is in private but muhammad said fasting is in public.

there's a lot more, but cant remember them all.

Debmey

Did the Holy Spirit meet the disciples? Haven't you read the book of Acts? Its an entire book about it. Surely GG has never read the Bible before, otherwise he wouldn't be asking such questions. Ahahahahahahahahahahaha......................

Mo did not appear to the disciples at all, so how can Mo is the Holy Spirit?
Neither did Mo remind anyone of Jesus teachings.

cheers

greekgod

Originally posted by me at 2-3-2005 06:24 AM:



John 14:26
But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.


did muhamm ...

Is that all.. did Holy Ghost say the same?

Funnily, you have just forgotten, about 10 commandments!
Jesus come as the continuity from previous prophets....
And muhammad doesnt have to be bound to what did jesus
preach, where god had clearly shown, and those prohets also
clearly said : they were sent to the people of israel, not humankind!

i asked for proof that holy ghost came and preach and listen and speak like Jesus... where's the proof?

Debmey

If you claim that Mo does not have to be bound by what Jesus said, the Mo does not qualify to be the Comforter, its that simple.

Mo was sent only to the Arabs.