HOPE and FEAR to GOD

gunblade712

so now you can't differentiate between man-made law and God's Law?

Sephiroth

by totally

so seph...are you slave of your god?

Nope, My God does not need a slave. My God is my friend.


by anti-israel

his is why i' telling you that you do not understand the difference between ISLAM and MUSLIM....

ISLAM do not need race...
the race need ISLAM to move forward....
ISLAM do not need MUSLIM....
but MUSLIM need ISLAM.... (ko paham x ni???)

WRONG. A lot of races on this Planet who are not Muslims ARE MOVING FORWARD.

The crap about you needing Islam to move forward is a LIE. Proof - 95% of ALL MUSLIM NATIONS are in poverty. Islamic nations which has technology to improve themselves are busy making bombs to fight "infidels".

Your ISLAM is the reason why you are left behind by other races and it will be the reason why everyone will leave Muslims behind in the future.


by dutchy

...  if you think that Malays are the only race that are Muslims, and thus believer and follower of Islam, then what about Cat Stevens? the last time I check he is not a malay ...

And WHO said that all Muslims have to be Malays? Or Arabs for that matter.

Muslims is a race created by Muhammad for his followers. Muslims means those who Follow Islam - regardless of their background. Therefore, those who follow Islam = MUSLIMS = A RACE. UNDERSTAND?

Anyone who is not a Muslim BUT choose to follow Islam = MUSLIM. Regardless of where he was born, what is his name, whatwas his former religions etc. It matters NOT. Understand?

Sephiroth

by gunblade712

so now you can't differentiate between man-made law and God's Law?

Only difference between a Man-made Law and god's Law is the person who deliver it.

Those who calls it "god's laws" are usually fanatics who doesn't know God, who have a large member of fools who willing to follow them blindly and will not question whatever nonsense that person stated in name of some god.

gunblade712

by Sephiroth

Muslims is a race created by Muhammad for his followers. Muslims means those who Follow Islam - regardless of their background. Therefore, those who follow Islam = MUSLIMS = A RACE. UNDERSTAND?

Anyone who is not a Muslim BUT choose to follow Islam = MUSLIM. Regardless of where he was born, what is his name, whatwas his former religions etc. It matters NOT. Understand?


Muslim comes from the arabic word "Islam" , sephiroth. Arabs added the prefix of the letter م to the verb..

safar (travel)--> musafar (traveller)

so "Muslim" is from the word "Mu" and "Islam" ...

Islam (way of life) --> Muslim (person who follow Islam)

Allah s.w.t Himself told us in the Quran that He created many races so that people many know each other, then He s.w.t told us that we (the Muslims) should UNITE..

if MUSLIMS IS A RACE, then WHY does Allah says that we should get to know each other's race???

your allegations i based on your ASSUMPTION. you know NOTHING of those words..

so ASK before you SPEAK, UNDERSTAND HINDU?
kau tak payah nak tunjuk kau punya sifat BERLAGAK dengan BONGKAK kau kat sini, kalau kau tuh PENGECUT dan BACUL bila orang ajak berjumpa.. (worst, SEPHIROTH SENDIRI YANG CABAR NAK BUNUH MUSLIM, tapi DIA SENDIRI YANG BACUL BILA AJAK JUMPA...)

[ Last edited by  gunblade712 at 30-3-2009 12:07 ]

kinki

define a race
Muslim is a race??? Crap!!!!!!

kinki

Originally posted by Sephiroth at 30-3-2009 09:43
by gunblade712

so now you can't differentiate between man-made law and God's Law?

Only difference between a Man-made Law and god's Law is the person who deliver it.

Those who calls it  ...

Obviously you can't differentiate between the man-made and God's law.
Who delivers what???

anti_israel

Balas #91 Sephiroth\ catat

if you are saying god as your shield....

which god????

anti_israel

"The crap about you needing Islam to move forward is a LIE. Proof - 95% of ALL MUSLIM NATIONS are in poverty."

how do you define that statistic????

peh...

men tembak je ko ni kan.....

anti_israel

encik sephiroth tau tak nape umat islam (muslim) di zaman ini mundur.... miskin..... lemah....

nak tau nape????

sebab orang islam (muslim) zaman ini tidak lagi menjalani hidup mereka 100% seperti yang di syariatkan oleh Allah (tuhanku dan tuahn ko jugak...)

bukti sudah ada...

jika umat islam hidup 100% dalam kehidupan yang disayariatkan oleh Allah s.w.t....

maka kegemilangan akan dikecapi...

takkan ko x baca sejarah.....

emapayar uthmaniah....

emapayar abbasiah... dan bermacam-macam lagi (yang aku x dapat sebutkan disini sebab kurang penegtahuan)...

malah ISLAm sendiri telah membawa Eropah keluar dari Zaman Gelapnya hasil asimilasi ilmu yang diterokai dengan mendalam oleh ilmuan islam..... you have to admit that... if not... you really now nothing about history...

zaman skarang????

ko boleh tengik sendiri kan....

bila orang Islam x lagi menjalankan hukum-hukum dan arahan dari Allah s.w.t 100%.. apa jadik?? bila dunia dilebihkan dari mencari bekalan ke akhirat... apa jadik???

maka benarlah hadis nabi.....

The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: "Nations are about to scheme against you in the same way as greedy eaters vie with one another on the dining-table.' One of the companions (may Allah be pleased with them all) asked: 'O Messenger of Allah! Will that relate to being few in numbers?' The Prophet said: 'No, but your huge number will be of little effectiveness, and (Allah) will cast Al-Wahan in your hearts.' They said: O Messenger of Allah, what does Al-Wahan mean? He said, 'Your hearts are strongly attached to life luxuries and you feel strong aversion to death." (Reported by Ahmad and Abu-Dawud) ...

so...

your statement about islam making muslim moving backward... is totally wrong seph....

p/s: peh.. baik gila cara aku cakap ngan ko ari ni....

gunblade712

tengok sejarah sepanyol dulu2 dah cukup..

dutchy

And WHO said that all Muslims have to be Malays? Or Arabs for that matter.

Muslims is a race created by Muhammad for his followers. Muslims means those who Follow Islam - regardless of their background. Therefore, those who follow Islam = MUSLIMS = A RACE. UNDERSTAND?

Anyone who is not a Muslim BUT choose to follow Islam = MUSLIM. Regardless of where he was born, what is his name, whatwas his former religions etc. It matters NOT. Understand?

well, I got a friend who just converted to Islam ( ahamdulilah) , thus he is refer to as our fellow Muslims, but he is still a Frenchman you know Sep, so your claim is invalid here

Hindu - Hindus
Judaism - Jews

and you can fill in the blanks, when you said that Muslim is a race, then that is certainly a wrong definition of Muslim, how can it be that  believers of Islam being considered as a RACE, when we are Muslims, nothing more nothing less









[ Last edited by  dutchy at 1-4-2009 22:38 ]

Sephiroth

IF that is true, THEN WHAT IS A MUSLIM?

In all purposes, Muhammad have separated followers and non-followers who follows Islam and those who deny Islam into two category. The believers falls under what Category - Muslims and they are told not to interact (much) with non-Muslims who could bring them out of Islam.

Same goes for Jews. Who are the Jews? From religious point of view - they are the People who Moses brought out of Egypt and set up at the Promised Land.

All this shows that Muslims ARE A RACE. Denying this is meaningless.

Which also means that when a person become a Muslim, it does not matter if he is an Indian, Chinese, Westerner or anything else. He have become a MUSLIM (a new race).

gunblade712

IF that is true, THEN WHAT IS A MUSLIM?

a person who follows Islam. I've told you that. I've even EXPLAINED TO YOU HOW the word Muslim came to be.

In all purposes, Muhammad have separated followers and non-followerswho follows Islam and those who deny Islam into two category. Thebelievers falls under what Category - Muslims and they are told not tointeract (much) with non-Muslims who could bring them out of Islam.

Who told you that? Forward your proof if what you're claiming are true and valid, Sephiroth. As for as I know Muhammad s.a.w. and his Sahabah interacted with the Jews and the Pagans, they even traded with them, and the Jewish people were under the protection of the Muslims when Madinah was declared.

Plus, there are various hadith across the Sahih Bukhari and Muslim stating that the Prophet Muhammad s.a.w. visited a sick Jew and Jewess.

Same goes for Jews. Who are the Jews? From religious point of view -they are the People who Moses brought out of Egypt and set up at thePromised Land.

All this shows that Muslims ARE A RACE. Denying this is meaningless.

now don't compare us with the Jews. They wanted only their blood to inherit their religion. It is proven because our Jewish friend migdal bavel explained to us that should the non-Jew wanted to accept Judaism, they would have to carry only 7 testament instead of hundreds of testament for the true Jewish blood (I forgot the latter's number)

Which also means that when a person become a Muslim, it does not matterif he is an Indian, Chinese, Westerner or anything else. He have becomea MUSLIM (a new race).

let's see now, what does wikipedia say about the definition of "race" :

The term race or racial group usually refers to the categorization of humans into populations or groups on the basis of various sets of heritable characteristics.[1] The most widely used human racial categories are based on salient traits (especially skin color, cranial or facial features and hair texture), and self-identification.[1][2]

Conceptions of race, as well as specific ways of grouping races, vary by culture and over time, and are often controversial for scientific as well as social and political reasons. The controversy ultimately revolves around whether or not the concept of race is biologically warranted;[3][4] the ways in which political correctness might fuel either the affirmation or the denial of race;[5][6]and the degree to which perceived differences in ability andachievement, categorized on the basis of race, are a product ofinherited (i.e., genetic) traits or environmental, social and culturalfactors.

exerpts from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_(classification_of_human_beings)

well, the definition DID NOT say about religious separation, sephiroth.


Muslims is those who accepted Islam, be him/her a Jew, Indian, Chinese, Polish, Danish, American, Australian, Arab and so forth.

p/s sbb tuh ada kaum 'INDIA MUSLIM' kat Malaysia nih, they are Indians (and they are proud of it, alhamdulillah), but they are Muslims. The race is Indian, the faith is Islam (Muslim)

Sephiroth

by Gunblade712

The term race or racial group usually refers to the categorization of humans into populations or groups on the basis of various sets of heritable characteristics.[1] The most widely used human racial categories are based on salient traits (especially skin color, cranial or facial features and hair texture), and self-identification.[1][2]

The Religion falls into the category of Self-identification.

Muslims identify themselves as Followers of Islam - thus that is a Self-Identification for a group of people who have speacial characteristics (of being a Muslim) when compare to the general populations. Therefore - Muslims are a RACE.

gunblade712

self-identification?

ohhh.. so if a Chinese man accepted Hindu (and live his life like a Hindu), what is his race?

Debmey

He is still Chinese.

What about a malay? Can a malay be a Christian?

Sephiroth

by Gunblade712

hhh.. so if a Chinese man accepted Hindu (and live his life like a Hindu), what is his race?

A Chinese man who accept Hindusm but choose to live as Chinese is still a Chinese person (who is Hindu). There are many like that in Malaysia and you can see some of them during Thaipusam celebration.

Matter a fact, Hindus will treat him as a fellow Hindu also, despite of the different way he lives, the color of his skin and such.

However, if a Chinese person accept Islam, he cannot live as a Chinese. He cannot go to Chinesetemples, eat Chinese food, sleep with Chinese woman (unless she is muslim and married to him) and even have to change his name to Bin Abdullah.

This shows that the man HAVE TO change his Identifications completely - from being Chinese man to become a Muslim man. IT IS A MUST if he is to become a Muslim.

Therefore, Self-identification shows that Muslims are a race.

gunblade712

but according to Sephiroth, it's based on his definition of "self-identification" , and that Chinese man lived his life as a Hindu... how can he be a Chinese, if we based on Sephroth's definition?

gunblade712

Originally posted by Sephiroth at 2-4-2009 11:02
However, if a Chinese person accept Islam, he cannot live as a Chinese.He cannot go to Chinesetemples, eat Chinese food, sleep with Chinesewoman (unless she is muslim and married to him) and even have to changehis name to Bin Abdullah.

Who says we can't do all that? I mean, I did go to the Chinese temples (not to pray, of course). If he wanna go to pray to that idol, of course it is forbidden. Don't tell me Hindu allows it's followers to go and worship other deities from other religion?

can't eat Chinese food? For the love of Allah, it's my favourite dish! As long as there is no pork or other prohibited stuff in it, it's ok for us to eat. Where did you get THAT idea that it is prohibited for him to eat Chinese food?

change his name to "bin Abdullah" is other misconception. Nowhere in the teachings does it says that it is compulsory for you to change your name to ".... bin Abdullah" if you accepted Islam. Ever heard of "Lim Joi Soon" ? He's a Chinese man who accepted Islam, and his name is still "Lim Joi Soon" , and he's a Malaysian, if you are wondering.

Sephiroth

by Gunblade712

but according to Sephiroth, it's based on his definition of "self-identification" , and that Chinese man lived his life as a Hindu... how can he be a Chinese, if we based on Sephroth's definition?

Because there is no such restrictions like cannot do this and that like Islam have in Hinduism. In Hinduism, how one lives his life is according to his own will - BUT HE MUST REMEMBER THAT EVERYTHING HE DOES, IT FOLLOWS THE LAWS OF KARMA. Good and the bad things he does, will follow him in this lifetime and the next.


change his name to "bin Abdullah" is other misconception.

I have no interest in listening to your tongue flapping, for I know you have no honor in your words. PUT VERSES from Al Quran stating your claim.

PS : That goes the same for your other claims as well.