[MERGED]--Room inside Kaba is a forbidden.Why? - Pict page 43

Prestige of the Ka'bah

The Ka'bah was held in high esteem by various nations. The Hindus respected it, believing that the spirit of Siva, the third person of their Trimurty, entered into the Black Stone, when he was accompanied by his wife visited Hijjaz.

The Sabaeans of Persia and Chaledonia counted it as one of their seven holy sanctuaries [The seven sanctuaries were: (1 ) The Ka'bah; (2) Mars - on the summit of a mountain in Isfahan; (3) "Mandusan"? in India; (4) Naw Bahar in Balkh; (5) House of Ghamdan in San'a; (6) Kawsan in Farghana, Khurasan; and (7) a House in Upper China. (Author's Note)]. Many of them said that it was the House of the Saturn - because it was the most ancient, and the longest in existence.

The Persians too respected the Ka'bah, believing that the spirit of Hormoz was present therein; they sometimes went for its pilgrimage.

The Jews honored it and worshipped God there according to the religion of Ibrahim. There were many pictures and images in the Ka'bah, including those of Ibrahim and Isma'il which had divining arrows in their hands. Also there were pictures of the virgin Mary and Christ - which indicates that the Christians too respected the Ka'bah like the Jews.

The Arabs held it in the highest esteem; they believed that it was the House of Allah, and came to its pilgrimage from every place. They believed the Ka'bah to be built by Ibrahim and the hail to be a part of his religion which had come to them as his legacy.

So what if you cannot even make sense of all this rituals and beliefs? What for?

Truth.8

Originally posted by Gray at 16-11-2003 11:44 PM:
Prestige of the Ka'bah

The Ka'bah was held in high esteem by various nations. The Hindus respected it, believing that the spirit of Siva, the third person of their Trimurty, entered into the Black Stone, when he was accompanied by his wife visited Hijjaz.

The Sabaeans of Persia and Chaledonia counted it as one of their seven holy sanctuaries [The seven sanctuaries were: (1 ) The Ka'bah; (2) Mars - on the summit of a mountain in Isfahan; (3) "Mandusan"? in India; (4) Naw Bahar in Balkh; (5) House of Ghamdan in San'a; (6) Kawsan in Farghana, Khurasan; and (7) a House in Upper China. (Author's Note)]. Many of them said that it was the House of the Saturn - because it was the most ancient, and the longest in existence.

The Persians too respected the Ka'bah, believing that the spirit of Hormoz was present therein; they sometimes went for its pilgrimage.

The Jews honored it and worshipped God there according to the religion of Ibrahim. There were many pictures and images in the Ka'bah, including those of Ibrahim and Isma'il which had divining arrows in their hands. Also there were pictures of the virgin Mary and Christ - which indicates that the Christians too respected the Ka'bah like the Jews.

The Arabs held it in the highest esteem; they believed that it was the House of Allah, and came to its pilgrimage from every place. They believed the Ka'bah to be built by Ibrahim and the hail to be a part of his religion which had come to them as his legacy. .

U don't have to teach me about Sivalingam or trimurti because I have already study those things.

My question still unanswere, where is the photos???

don't talk about history of  kabbah, trimurti , curtain and whatever.

I need photos of tiny room inside the Ka'bah.

if u muslims failed to response, i consider your religion is based on moon god diety called allah and NOT from true God.

Truth.8

Special events

Every Friday afternoon after the "Jumu抋," those who have been sentenced to death, or hand cutting or whipping are to be punished in public, so that people can learn the fear of Allah and his horrible judgments about sin and disobedience. The punishments are held outside the city on a hill. Unfortunately, several Christians, who have been found guilty of worshipping Jesus or giving testimony about him, have been decapitated at that same spot....

One of the other necessary rituals of Hajj is called "Tawafu Assa抷". During the "Tawafu Assa抷" ritual, pilgrims have to walk as fast as they can, back and forth between places called "Assafa" and "Almarwa", chanting verses from the Koran and making their wishes to Allah. Those weak people who have survived the Tawaf of Ka抌a (7 circles around the shrine), are exposed to yet another risk of being trampled beneath the feet of the strong. Therefore, more pilgrims will be 'sacrificed' to Allah on the path between Assafa and Almarwa.

According to Islamic beliefs and tradition, the area between Assafa and Almarwa is the very place where Genesis 21:15-20 took place. Hagar (Allah抯 chosen wife for Abraham), was the first one who performed that ritual and was supposed to have made a wish to Allah to provide water for her son. Meanwhile, her little boy, who was sitting on the ground and crying, dug a hole in the sand and, miraculously, the water came out as a result of Allah抯 answer to Hagar抯 wish. Then, according to Islam, she called the well "Zamzam" (which means hush baby, don抰 cry anymore!) The story goes on to say that it was at that time Hagar realized why Allah sent her and her son to that desert place. It was supposedly the site where Allah抯 shrine had rested before. Later, it is said that Allah showed Ishmael and his father the black stone and commanded them to rebuild the shrine and call people to worship Allah there.

Many details in Allah-Muhammad抯 version of Genesis 21:1-21 contradict the Bible and its original details. There is no mention in the Bible of Mecca being a place of worship of the true G-d at all. According to the Bible, Ishmael lived far from Mecca, in the desert of Paran (around Beersheba). There is no historical evidence that can support any fact that either Hagar, Ishmael or Abraham had ever reached the soil of Mecca. However, Muslims believe that the Jews have twisted the Biblical account out of hatred and jealousy toward Ishmael and his descendants.

According to Muslim belief, Allah抯 promise of a savior was made to Abraham about the seed of Ishmael, not of Isaac. They claim that Muhammad抯 version of the story in the Koran is the true and genuine one, and that Jews should be punished and even exterminated for their 'perversion of the truth', although, again, there is no historical evidence to prove their version of the story.

(Note: Please be aware that Allah and the True God of Israel are not one and the same, even though Muslims claim that they are.)

[ Last edited by Truth.8 on 16-11-2003 at 11:55 PM ]

hmm  there seemed to be somethin like buzzin sounds in here

Truth.8

Originally posted by Gray at 16-11-2003 11:53 PM:
hmm  there seemed to be somethin like buzzin sounds in here

does my words sound buzzin or do u feel guilt about your faith???

Trusteeship of the Ka'bah

The trusteeship was in the hands of Isma'il; and after him it remained in his descendants. Then the Jurhumites became more powerful and took over the trusteeship. They in their turn were vanquished - after several wars

Truth.8

Would u be dumb if true God ask u:

1) hve u consider to find out what inside the tiny dark room behind the Ka'ba??

What would be your answer then????

In court, anyone who committed crime, the Judge will ask evidences. Written evidences is less effective but photos and images is more effectives.

In judgment day, True God is going to ask u Muslims same question.

1) hve u consider to find out what inside the tiny dark room behind the Ka'ba??

Truth.8

Comments:

Adam's and Eve's fall was spiritual, not a literal fall from a 'planet to earth'. They were driven out from the garden of Eden.

There is no evidence or information about any shrine/temple/tabernacle built for God, before Moses. Nether Adam nor Abraham built a building for prayer or pilgrimage.

Ishmael was a lad when Abraham sent him and his mother away, not a tiny baby.

Ishmael settled in Midian, between Israel and Egypt, hundreds of miles away from Mecca.

Ka'bah was never mentioned once in the Bible as a temple for the YHWH. The only symbolic mention of Ka'bah in the Bible is in the prophetic/apocalyptic book of Revelation, chapter 17.

There is no historical or archeological evidence about Ka'bah and Mecca's origin and dating back to Abraham's and Ishmael's time. Actually, the founding of Ka'bah and Mecca is still a 'mystery'. The main reason is because Saudi authorities wouldn't allow anybody to touch the 'holy ground' or to dig for the city's origin and past.

The story of the Ethiopian king Abraha has no evidences of its occurrence, except its record in the Muslims 'holy' book, the Quran, which dedicates a whole chapter for the story as if it were a well known fact.

Mecca didn't become a 'universal' religious center until the appearance of Islam. Even by the time of Muhammed, sectarian Jews and Christians of Arabia, used to face Jerusalem in their prayers and not the Ka'bah.

Truth.8

As we all know, some of Satan's main characters are lying, deceiving and thief who tries to rob things that belong to God and turns them into his. No wonder that he took one of the most significant symbolic elements about God's message about His Son and turned it into joke. However, God in His infinite wisdom, He has allowed Satan to rob that element and to make part of the rituals he dictated in his Quran and Babylonian religion of Islam. Why? The Lord didn't permit Muslims (Ishmael's seed) to stay without a testimony about the sacrifice and work He accomplished on their behalf on the cross. Despite the fact that Muslims firmly deny the literal crucifixion, death and resurrection of Christ, by believing that they are following Abraham's action, they actually testify against themselves that God provided a substitute to spare Abraham's son from death, a shadow of Christ's sacrifice.

Interesting elements about the rite and similarities with the biblical teachings: According to the Islamic law and tradition, there are some specific conditions to be met, as follow: The sacrifice is to be held once a year. It is similar to the Day of Atonement, which takes place once a year, and a testimony that Christ had to die only once. The animal destined for sacrifice should be a male animal, preferably a ram (sheep), over a year old and has no defect or disease. The animal's requirements are similar to the biblical requirements, which symbolize Jesus Christ, the innocent lamb without any blemish, the only pleasing sacrifice to God and way of reconciliation with Him. The Imam (national priest) should be the first one to slaughter the sheep, for himself and on behalf of all of the community, especially, those who cannot afford it. The sacrifice is an obligation only for the Imam, the rest are doing it only optional. This is another similarity with the OT high priest's atonement on behalf of the nation. Only one sacrifice is required and obligatory, the rest are only optional. It is also a testimony about Christ's death for all. The sacrificed ram should be shared between the community, especially the poor, those who cannot afford have their own animal should get a portion of meat and on that same day. According to some customs, families exchange meat or invite each other to share in eating with them. The idea here is similar to the Passover lamb and how all the community shares in it. This also a testimony that all people, especially the lowly ones should hear the Gospel and receive Christ so that the joy can be complete. The day of sacrifice is right in the middle of the week's long spiritual journey. Without sacrifice, the Hajj is of no value to Muslims. Jesus came in the middle of the earth's history week of God's plan for redemption. Another interpretation, if Jesus is to be taken out of the picture, humans journey (pilgrimage) in life and works for seeking righteousness are totally empty and in vain.

The sad part, Muslims do not think about why they follow Abraham's example by sacrificing an innocent and helpless animal. They blindly do the action, feed their bellies and rejoice for a time, but forget to really focus on the essence of it. In one hand, it's because the event has become more of a tradition rather than a spiritual task. On the other hand, it is because Satan has blinded their eyes and deafened their ears so that they couldn't understand. And that is by adding to the event some demonic and Babylonian yeast.

Demonic elements in the sacrifice's ritual: The animal is to be sacrificed to Allah, a pagan god, whom Satan has turned into 'God.' In the above Quranic verse (22:36), the meaning of sacrifice has been perverted and turned into a bribe given by Allah to those who worship him at Mecca and bow to his idol, Ka'bah. Satan in his craftiness, in the Quran twisted the Genesis account about Abraham's attempt to sacrifice Isaac. He used the word "only son" instead of Isaac for the purpose of confusion and leading Muslims astray. Muslims speculate that Ishmael was the son, not Isaac and therefore miss the point and turn 180 degree off from the truth and God's message of redemption.

Maybe many also worship the tree under which Buddha sat for days?

so what value to the true God.

all idol worshippers doomed

Fuzzman

Ehhhh . I will be expecting the audience of Truth and SFE Talk in my coming thread on Kaabah. Make sure you guys are as vocal  there as you are in here. Sorry I'm not contributing anything here because all I read was just pure speculation and extreme hallucinations. Oh yes, not to worry, I will be praying for your souls when and if the two of you dare step into my coming thread on Kaaba.

ARI FUZZMAN

[ Last edited by Fuzzman on 17-11-2003 at 01:44 AM ]

Sephiroth

by Josh40

Maybe many also worship the tree under which Buddha sat for days?

so what value to the true God.

all idol worshippers doomed  


That's 2nd time you take a strike at Buddhism (Hindusm not yet). :eek:

So, what's your problem with Buddhism? Some Buddhist pissed you off or what? :stp:

Stick with the thread, Josh ... SFE is taking on Muslims and their Kaabah, NOT Buddhism.

Sephiroth

Speaking of which ... For those who want to learn about the Kaabah and the fiasco inside Mecca, watch National Geography's special feature called "Inside Mecca" which is on this month (maybe till Ramadan is over).


One question ... it seems that Meccan make a large black silk cloth, with words from Al Quran sewed into it in threads of gold and hang it around the Kaabah EVERY YEAR. The cost to make this ornament is about 10 million dollars a YEAR!

Here's the Questions :

1. I don't remember Muhammad starting any fiasco like this in his days. Where did this practise came from?

2. Isn't SILK happened to be HARAM in Islam because it was made from living worms?

3. Doesn't Al Quran has something like "Menbazir itu kawan kpd Syaitan" somewhere? 10 millions dollars a year in every Ramadhan time is definately a waste, isn't it?

>>1) hve u consider to find out what inside the tiny dark room behind the Ka'ba?? <<<

another tinier and darker room..?

Originally posted by Sephiroth at 17-11-2003 08:32 AM:
Speaking of which ... For those who want to learn about the Kaabah and the fiasco inside Mecca, watch National Geography's special feature called "Inside Mecca" which is on this month (ma ...

Fiasco? what fiasco? - do you know what the word means?

As for the draping or kiswah ,The Ka'aba had been covered by a kiswah since ancient times. The first to place a cover upon it being the King As'ad Tubba' of Yemen. The holy Messenger of Allah, Muhammad (peace be upon him) let it remain on the day he conquered Makkah in the eighth year of the Hijrah and during the centuries that followed, the caliphs, kings, and princes have cared for this covering of the Ka'abah which is changed annually. At one time a new kiswah was draped over the old one year after year until the 8th century A.D. This cover has been made in a special factory in Makkah since the year 1357 A.H. The Kiswah is made of pure silk and it is embroidered with Qur'anic verses by expert craftsmen using pure gold and silver threads - the expense is borne by the government of the Saudi Arabian Kingdom.

Again, "Inside Mecca", produced by Anisa Mehdi  is not about any 'fiasco'.
  

:eek:http://www.nationalgeographic.co.uk/insidemecca/home.shtml

[ Last edited by KENNKID on 17-11-2003 at 01:04 PM ]

Truth.8

Originally posted by Fuzzman at 17-11-2003 01:43 AM:
Ehhhh . I will be expecting the audience of Truth and SFE Talk in my coming thread on Kaabah. Make sure you guys are as vocal  there as you are in here. Sorry I'm not contributing anything here because all I read was just pure speculation and extreme hallucinations. Oh yes, not to worry, I will be praying for your souls when and if the two of you dare step into my coming thread on Kaaba.

b4 u post topic on Kabbah, pls get information or possible images/photos inside the tiny room of kabbah then I will participate.

[ Last edited by Truth.8 on 17-11-2003 at 04:04 PM ]

Truth.8

Would u be dumb if true God ask u:

1) hve u consider to find out what inside the tiny dark room behind the Ka'ba??

What would be your answer then????

In court, anyone who committed crime, the Judge will ask evidences. Written evidences is less effective but photos and images is more effectives.

In judgment day, True God is going to ask  Muslims same question.

1) hve u consider to find out what inside the tiny dark room behind the Ka'ba??

Truth.8

Originally posted by KENNKID at 17-11-2003 12:58 PM:
Fiasco? what fiasco? - do you know what the word means?

As for the draping or kiswah ,The Ka'aba had been covered by a kiswah since ancient times. The first t ...

I am not interested inside Mecca but INSIDE TINY ROOM AT KABBAH.

Do u hve problem reading my thread????


get photos otherwise you muslims praying sometimes which not belonged to True God.

Originally posted by Truth.8 at 17-11-2003 01:11 PM:
I am not interested inside Mecca but INSIDE TINY ROOM AT KABBAH.

Do u hve problem reading my thread????


get photos otherwise you muslims praying sometimes which not belonged to True God.

I wasn't talking to you. I was responding to what Sephiroth said. Your search for that so-called  tiny room with an idol (something which is clearly forbidden in Islam & you know it very well)  is already a forgone conclusion - it is inside your head - look for it.:2cool: