Science Perspective: World's Creation According to Bible

greekgod

hey hey hey...

is it become compulsory that invite scientist to listen to your lecture..

just provide your post here...

if necessary, i'll post them to another 'people' with 'higher credibility'
i have been invited few people to join, but only KaiserPhoenix answer it..

so.. wait, and they'll come to listen to you..

but FOR NOW... POST YOUR ANSWER!!!!

or, YOU DONT HAVE ANSWER, BUT SCARED OF LOSING FACE, (and your faith too?)

hah.. debmey.. do be so hyprocrite!@

Debmey

Before we waste our time, will you stand by the BBT? It will be meaningless if you don't cos you made the serious error of challenging the Bible based on the BBT. If you refuse, then I suggest that you retract this attack, and apologise for it.  Fair isn't it?

greekgod

yes..i will stand by BBT and i will prove from quran point of view,if necessary. but that not necessary yet..

because what i need now is your answer regarding that..

dont try to stray away!

ok, i give you option now... you can say you dont have the answer, and i will stop asking about that!

Debmey

OK, can you tell us how the small atoms such as hydrogen and supposedly helium formed after the alledged Big Bang came together to form bigger atoms?

Debmey

Have you been following this thread? Will you stand by the BBT too since you are obviously a Muslim that is anti Christianity?

Debmey

Will you stand by BBT? That is the question sonny.

greekgod

Originally posted by Debmey at 27-1-2005 05:45 PM:
OK, can you tell us how the small atoms such as hydrogen and supposedly helium formed after the alledged Big Bang came together to form bigger atoms?

havent you learned science dear?

how many atoms and particles that form 'debmey'?

that later can make movement, speak, and react?

so many atoms in your body!

then, it is a very stupid question to ask how the small atoms can formed to make the big bang..

i think you have met the wrong person here..

science is lovely subject, mathematic is something i always amazing me, and nature is all about that i loved to join with!



now... answer me.... how and why do you reject big bang theory?

gimme answer.. dont try to pissing away!

Debmey

You see, you don't even know a very basic tenet of the BBT, how can you possibly stand by it.
BBT says that small atoms such as hydrogen are formed after the big bang. Lets assume it is true. the next step is, how did all those hydrogen form into bigger atoms such as carbon, oxygen or nitrogen? Any clues?

greekgod

havent you learned the latest science development?

there are two guys who just received their noble prize..
they prove there are other smaller than atom we know today...

i shall post something about it later..

but, does my understanding about BBT important?

because so far, i have been writing article, i will presume the reader do not know, or know a little about what i am talking, therefore i write something useful..

why dont you apply this, and let ASSUME, i dont know about BBT and world's formation.

You claim that you thought on this subject, and again i want to learn something from you..

teach me then!

Debmey

[size=] What nonsence are yu talkin abt my fren? i know there are sub-atmomic particles, but i am asking yu how hydrogen form into bigger atams as postulated by BBT. You mean you dunno? Then how yu want to stand by BBT? How to attack Bible like that?

peacei

KaiserPheonix

Hmm.. interesting debate on the Big Blow-Up...

For greekgod
==========

I am very sure that you are a mathematician, so it is without doubt that you are a little shaky on the Theory.

The Theory is, from a small, compact infinitisimal space, in the absudly hot temperature, that primordial space *expanded*, well, it's not like a bomb explode, you know. The term Bang is coined as the expansion took place in a fraction of a second... and as time goes by, the temperature gets cooler.

OK, by the cooling of the universe, hydrogen atoms forms to other elements, thus creating the 108 known elements today. Remember, the hot temperature gives way to implosion and splitting of atoms.

==========================================

Biblical states that the world was created in "layers", that is the air, the earth, the light, the dark and so on. What I mean on layers is the creation is done one by one, (And The Lord saw it was good), then only He perfected the other. Well, the Scriptures states in 7 days, Lord Created the world, and all of its contents, however, postulating from the last three creation, how it could be that the earth, the flora and the fauna were created so close a time? There are no footnotes that interprate the term "7 days". To conclude that the 7 days is perhaps the same present 24-hour day, well, I don't know.

==========================================

Well, sub-atomic particles were just only found recently... in the later of the last century. There are leptons, quarks, and some anti-negative subatomic particle that could be *even* (how they did this? Crazy scientist!) split into two more... A. Einstein himself stated that these three particles is composed from even more, smaller sub-particles.... The way they differ is their vibration rate... Just like different notes on a violin gives different sound, or tune.

=============================================

KaiserPheonix

Perhaps it is time that both of you relax and get a grip on what you are talking about!

greekgod

sure dude.. thanks for a nice information.. you just made debmey life even difficult!

greekgod

i think, now debmey meet the real opponent for him...

a mathematician and a physicist, both have interest in religion comparison!

Debmey

I think GG does not even know Kaiser is talking about.
Kaiser himself is also a bit off cos he thinks that all 108 elements are natural.

The question still remains. How did small atoms like hydrogen form into bigger atoms as alledged by the BBT?  

greekgod

then, make your point debmey...
throw in every facts that you have...

seem that you stuck somewhere...

Debmey

Nope, me not stuck, its you GG that is clearly stuck, even when you attack the Bible.
The question still remains. How did small atoms like hydrogen form into bigger atoms as alledged by the BBT?  

cheers

KaiserPheonix

To Debmey
==========

You've told that BBT is your field. Do you teach astronomy? It is interesting to know more about the universe outside our Mother Earth. Sadly, the Malaysian goverment is quite slow in promoting the importance of it. Well, you know how frustating the politicians and the academia community can be.

==========================================

I just want to re-state the World creation theory again in the Bible. You've asked that "greek" guy whether he stand on the BBT or not... I for one stand with BBT. Well, shouldn't science and religion be compatible wich each other? To me, Science is a channel for mankind to understand the creations of God. Let us just ignore the atheist scientists, for now.

Well, the Creation theory in the Bible is concentrated in the Book of Genesis. The name clearly shows the essence of the Book. It is split into two narratives, so the theory seems to split, and a few differences is observed.


I'll give short recital from the Book of Genesis, perhaps it is best that we compare the chronology of the creation, so that we can compare it to modern theory of creation.

1st Narrative (Gen, 1st Ch & 2nd Ch. 1-4a)
==============

1. He created heavens and earth, without form. (Perhaps it is the free space itself?)
2. God created Light, and separated Day and Night.
3. God created Heavens (perhaps it means the sky, not the Heaven of the God's Throne)
4. God created vegetation in pairs.
5. God created the sun and the moon. He also created stars.
6. God created sea monsters (animals), and birds
7. He created land beasts, cattles and all.
8. He created man in His own image, male and female (Adam and Eve).


2nd Narrative (Gen, 2nd Ch. 4b - 7)
===============

1. Created heaven and earth.
2. God created rain by evaporation.
3. God created Man from dust, then breathe life to them.
4. God created beasts and birds to be men's helpers.
5. God created Woman from the bone of Man.

=========================================================

It is quite baffling, when you read the theory, as the two Narrative contradicts. Moreover, it is in the same two Chapters, residing side-by side. Lets us say that these two sentence is the Word, then wich Narrative should be taken as the Bible's perspective of the world's creation?

==========================================================

Let us compare these two narrative overviews and the science overview of the Creation.

1. The universe is sized in a zero-volume space. The temparature is very high.

2. In split seconds, the universe expands to a few trillion times, the temperature cools.    (but it is still very hot).

3. Then, the unverse expand more and more, until the temperature drops to point where the      atoms could form.

4. These atoms are hydrogen atoms. The universe expand more and more, but in time, the     growth became slow, and the temparature cools to the present point. During that time,     the atoms split and collide to create the 108 elements we know today.

5. The gasses and elements, pulled by the forces of gravity, makes the planet and the stars, Whether it became planet or stars is determined by the gravity force that governs them. This even continue today. The Universe expands, almost unnoticed.

===============

7. Earth was formed. It was probably barren, perhaps it was covered with ice, much like Mars.

8. Scientists postulated that the showers of the meteors and the impact gives the rise of the first clouds, and thus, in time, rain developed. In time, the seas form.

9. After a few million years, bacteriae form, mikro algae appeared, then algae (with chlorophyl), and then simple-mikroorganisms is found.

10. After that, it seems that fish and sea animals were found. On the land, the insects roam, mainly the cokroaches, flies and dragonflies. Plants of water evolve to become land flora.

12. Millions of years after that, dinosaurs appeared, being the ancestor of reptiles. After the great Catastrophy, dinosaurs dissappred for about 10 Million years.

13. The first mammals appear. The birds were said has evolved from dinosaurs. Most probably,  the ancestor of many of the present mammals were in this era.

14. Thousands of years after that, the first human (humanoid form) appeared. Then, this humanoid is said to evolve to the present day form of homo-sapien.

=============================================================================

Well, perhaps it is time for us all to compare the statements of science an the statements of the Bible. Well, as a master of BBT, perhaps Debmey could correct me if I am wrong.

KaiserPheonix

Oh, about the elemets... I know that the elements did not form in the purest of form. Well, as a man of science,  thought you know that the elements combine to become stabil. Even on earth, the most elements from in the form of oxides, and carbonates. That is odd.

Then, after the growth and rise of alchemy, only then Men could synthesize and obtain the elements. The first to classify the elements sucessfully is Dmitri Mendeleyeev.

Hm... I do not think I am in the dark about chemistry and its history.

[ Last edited by KaiserPheonix on 29-1-2005 at 10:40 AM ]

Debmey

Wow! you write a lot my fren.

Can yu explain how did small atoms like hydrogen form into bigger atoms as alledged by the BBT?