[MERGED]-Debmey: SHOW PROOF THAT PROPHET MOHAMMAD IS A PAEDOPHILE?

Fuzzman

FaithHeckler wrote: Why pick on p.Muhammad when there were many ancient people had sex with kids? Its simply because those ancient weidos are not deemed as excellent examplar for other people, but Muhammadans claim that p.Muhammad is an excellent examplar for others.. and that is wrong.

Know what a Orientalist scholar is? Let me help you out here a bit. A Orientalist Scholar is essentially a non-Moslem scholar of Islam who comes from a Western origin who dedicates his manhours to study Islam and the life of the prophet of Islam. Understand now? Good.

Now Montgomery Watt is one such person. A Orientalist scholar who has been studying the prophet of Islam and this is what he had to say. Mind you that Montgomery ain't your regular "Muhammadan"? Mongomery is not your regular Christian missionary bigot [like you, Debmey or whoever else fits the shoe.] Many do not agree with what Montgomery has been throwing around about Islam but many have always viewed him as one of the more open-minded and open-hearted Orientalist scholars.  Possibly, this is because he was more of a promoter of understanding than a narrow-minded Christian missionary.  Years of studying Islam brought Watt to this conclusion:
The other main allegations of moral defect in Muhammad are that he was treacherous and lustful . . . Sufficient has been said above about the interpretation of these events to show that the case against Muhammad is much weaker than is sometimes thought. The discussions of these allegations, however, raises a fundamental question. How are we to judge Muhammad?  By the standards of his own time and country?  Or by those of the most enlightened opinion in the West today?  When the sources are closely scrutinized, it is clear that those of Muhammad's actions which are disapproved by the modern West were not the object of the moral criticism of his contemporaries.
From the standpoint of Muhammad's time, then, the allegations of treachery and sensuality cannot be maintained.  His contemporaries did not find him morally defective in any way. On the contrary, some of the acts criticized by the modern Westerner show that Muhammad's standards were higher than those of his time.  In his day and generation he was a social reformer, even a reformer in the sphere of morals. He created a new system of social security and a new family structure, both of which were a vast improvement on what went before. By taking what was best in the morality of the nomad and adapting it for settled communities, he established a religious and social framework for the life of many races of men. That is not the work of a traitor or 'an old lecher'.

Fuzzman hopes after this, you would not carry on the behavior of a "modern wierdo" who can't even understand the basic foundations of the person whom you willingly and without proof want to hang up to dry, when shamefully on your part, many Christian comtemporaries are coming forth with very much postive views of the prophet of Islam instead!

ARI FUZZMAN

[ Last edited by Fuzzman on 5-3-2005 at 09:51 PM ]

Debmey

From the hadith, we see that Mohd took fancy of a six year old babay and had sex with her when she was only 9 years old.
Looks like you beat around the bush but still can't explain away the paedophilia of Mohd. Thanks for keeping up the thread anyway.

peace

wira_melayu

Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 5-3-2005 02:41 AM:


You Muhammadans fail to understand that the term pedophile is used to describe an adult person, who had engaged sexually with prepubescent kid, regardless of condition, time or e ...

Thanks for the reply,firstly you mention that the word pedophile only exist in 19th century but why not in the 1st century?Again you can't prove that prophet Muhammad is a pedophile coz of a different timeline and i assume that even a 7 year old boy in the stone age would have a better mentallity than you do.

In all but you still failed to convince me that prophet Muhammad is a pedophile.Your allegations is based on today's theory which is not practical during those period.Please strenghten your points coz i don't really entertain nonsense theory,i repeat please.Your nonsense is the same like explaining to me that there's actually a computer in the 10th century by comparision to your baseless allegations which is not.So according to my logic there is no pedophile like there is no computer during those ages!period.

You still haven't answer my question yet.Have you ask your parents or your grandparents on when they started to get married?I will assume that they married at young ages which people of today will call it child marriage.

Then again you failed to explain your logic!:lol

:cak::cak::cak::cak::cak::cak::cak::cak::cak::cak::cak::cak::cak:

Debmey

The word paedophile applies to Mohd alright, regardless of whether there was a word for it when it happened.

FaithHealer3

Originally posted by wira_melayu at 2005-3-5 11:14 PM:


Thanks for the reply,firstly you mention that the word pedophile only exist in 19th century but why not in the 1st century?Again you can't prove that prophet Muhammad is ...

Think "gravity" not "computers". Like gravity, pedophilia act was there, long before a name was given to it.

P.Muhammad had sex with a 9year old girl. Its been recorded by Imam Bukhari, Imam Muslim, Abu Dawud even Tabari. Thats all the proof you need to called p.Muhammad as a pedophilie. Very simple actually yet you Muhammadans can't think.

As for you question.. My parent were in their 20s when they got married.. My grandparent were in thier late teen and 20s when they got married. happy now.

Can you answer this question.. since aenemy7 is anable to answer:  Show me just one hadith that says Aisha ALREADY had become baligh(had her period already) BEFORE p.Muhammad consummated his marriage with her.
Don't be shy. Just bring on.



[ Last edited by FaithHealer3 on 6-3-2005 at 06:58 AM ]

FaithHealer3

Originally posted by Fuzzyman at 2005-3-5 09:50 PM:

Fuzzman hopes after this, you would not carry on the behavior of a "modern wierdo" who can't even understand the basic foundations of the person whom you willingly and without proof want to hang up to dry.. blah blah blah

Aikk... you should blame you hadith recorders(like Bukhari, Muslim, Abu Dawud etc) for writing down the information about p.Muhammad boinking a 9year old girl. If there was no such records then there will be no issue about p.Muhammad as bring a pedophile.

FaithHealer3

This question goes to Fuzzman.

Do you agree that p.Muhammad is not a good example for other to follow/imitate IF its true that he had sex with Aisha when she was only 9years old.


so at least we can know where you stand.

aenemy7

Sex before marriage is immoral and illegal....wasn't the marriage of Aisha save her from adultery or phaedophile charges????:lol :lol :lol,

having sex with a woman before marriage is different than after marriage! legal & illegal!!! try to differ that.....there's already case about a 9 year old girl delivering a baby in modern time and u can't say Aisha doesn't fit to married the prophet,and it's 1400 years ago...

:lol :lol :lol ,try as hard as u can folks!!! ask your best priest or any best theologist to help u all...it's a challenge! :ah:


Allah Knows Best,Peace Yall.....

Debmey

Sex with children is immoral married or not married. Mo was clearly guilty of paedophilia by banging Aisha when she was only 9 years old.

If marriage justifies everything, how about having sex with a 2 year old?

Baiduri Othman

Originally posted by wira_melayu at 2005-3-5 11:14 PM:


Thanks for the reply,firstly you mention that the word pedophile only exist in 19th century but why not in the 1st century?Again you can't prove that prophet Muhammad is ...

My response:-

Oh boy, Faithhealer doesn't like you that much that he ignores your post. Yes, this is indeed a good post! :pompom::pompom::pompom:

Baiduri Othman

Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 2005-3-6 02:09 AM:




Aikk... you should blame you hadith recorders(like Bukhari, Muslim, Abu Dawud etc) for writing down the information about p.Muhammad boinking a 9year old girl. If there was n ...

My response:-

Why blames the hadith recorders where married at young age is normal in the ancient days??? It happened in India, China, Europe countries & else where in the ancient days. Come on people, it's not you don't use your head but you just want to smear Islam.

[ Last edited by Baiduri Othman on 6-3-2005 at 04:09 AM ]

Baiduri Othman

Originally posted by Debmey at 2005-3-6 03:57 AM:
Sex with children is immoral married or not married. Mo was clearly guilty of paedophilia by banging Aisha when she was only 9 years old.

If marriage justifies everything, how about having sex w ...

My response:-

You're ridiculous SFE but no matter how ridiculous you're, no one ever married to a 2 yr old child except having sex with them. Of course not the ancient Arabs but modern people ie. the Westerners. I read abt it in a magazine. Actually these paedophiles prefer Asian children b'coz they have soft skin & they like having sex with babies.

FaithHealer3

Originally posted by aenemy7 at 2005-3-6 03:26 AM:
Sex before marriage is immoral and illegal....wasn't the marriage of Aisha save her from adultery or phaedophile charges????:lol :lol :lol,

The charges are not against Aisha. She was a victim.

Baiduri Othman

Originally posted by FaithHealer3 at 2005-3-6 07:10 AM:


The charges are not against Aisha. She was a victim.

My response:-

How come Aisya' is a victim where marriage at young age are normal in the ancient days? Boy oh boy, don't you understand anything that marriage at young age was common during those days? Don't just simply ignore my post!!!

DivinePonytail

Originally posted by Baiduri Othman at 6-3-2005 04:07 AM:


My response:-

You're ridiculous SFE but no matter how ridiculous you're, no one ever married to a 2 yr old child except having sex with them. Of course not the ancient Arabs but modern peopl ...

Muslim say the darndest thing.

Accuse Christians of the west of being sexually perverted while exhaustively attempting to justify Muhammad sleeping with Aisha when she was 9 and he was 53. Maybe they should be saying that I believe that there is no God but Allah and Muhammad is the pedophile (instead of prophet) of Allah.

DivinePonytail

Originally posted by Baiduri Othman at 6-3-2005 03:58 AM:


My response:-

Oh boy, Faithhealer doesn't like you that much that he ignores your post. Yes, this is indeed a good post! :pompom::pompom::pompom:

Here's another one.

Claim that Muhammad抯 marriage to the 9 year old Aisha was a common culture practice of the day EVEN THOUGH Muhammad supposed to transcend man-made cultures and represent a model for all mankind. (So all men in their 50抯 should start raping 9 year old girls as God抯 perfect Model).

Baiduri Othman

Divine Ponytail, may I know why're you so keen to manipulate & exaggerate the issue? Marriage at such young age was very common in the ancient days. Why don't you ask your grandmas/grandpas? Even in the old days, I mean in the 30's, 50', 60's - women got married as young as 13 yrs old to guys as old as 20's, 30's, 40's, 50's etc!!!! You call that pedophiles????!!!!!

Why shd men in their 50's accused of raping their 9 yr old wife when the marriage is legitimate & she has reached puberty at that age? Anyway, I learnt the Prophet only consumated the marriage when Aisya' was 16 yrs old. He was married ONCE & ALL to a 9 yr old girl!!!!! Did he ever ever sleep or rape other minors before Aisya' that he can be classified as a PEDOPHILE?????? Does he have this abnormal sexual desire for young children that he can be classified as one?

Do you get that Divine Ponytail but not so that divine anyway??????? I want you to produce your facts here based on your very own opinions & not articles & no cut-n-paste pls!!!

[ Last edited by Baiduri Othman on 6-3-2005 at 12:17 PM ]

Fuzzman

Debmey wrote: From the hadith, we see that Mohd took fancy of a six year old babay and had sex with her when she was only 9 years old

Blah blah blah and more blahs but still no concrete proofs to show that Prophet Mohammad was a confirmed paedophile. Bukhari never says that the prophet was a paedophile. Everybody knows that marriage in early puberty was the norm from as early as the time of Abraham. So what have you got? You don't even dare comment on Montgomery Watt. It figures cos' he sure knows his stuff ..unlike you and the the likes of you like FaithHeckler [ who only knows heckling] and DivinePonytail [who "neverminds " the call of paedophile in Numbers 31:17-18] ? And yet you people have the nerve to just keep on rolling the "blah blah blahs"! LOL

DEbmey wrote: Looks like you beat around the bush but still can't explain away the paedophilia of Mohd. Thanks for keeping up the thread anyway.

Hahahaha you're one funnybone dear Debbo? You have a very funny way of "indirect self-description" because the fallout says it's you that's beating around the bush for your failure in pinning the paedophile tag on the prophet. That is why this thread is into page 20 and yet you still keep on insisting that your cold crappy soup of the day is still hot? Hell yeah, do me a Limp Biskit number and just keep on rolling baby cos' you Old school soldiers just passing up the hot shit and keep on bouncing in the mosh pit. What a bunch of jerk-offs? LOL

SO WHERE IS THE DA PROOF?

ARI FUZZMAN

aenemy7

There's no proof....there's no way! they can't even differ between sex before marriage and after marriage! they can't even proof a 9 year old girl cannot married or have a baby,they also cannot proof Aisha parents and the society at that time disapproved the marriage or rejected it...

Phaedophile today is sex before marriage or without any legal binding with a minor,Nowadays our young generations have many things to do such as school,career,computer games etc,marriage is not their target anymore but in the past marriage is considered an achievement just like graduating from university and have a good career in today standards, if they married a good guy who can take care of their wife is already considered an achievement of the women in the past!!!

Try again folks if u can,seek help from your best missionaries from around the world to proof your accusations, all they can proof was it was a marriage with blessings from both family....:lol :lol :lol


Allah Knows Best,Peace Yall...

Debmey

Originally posted by Baiduri Othman at 2005-3-6 12:15 PM:
Divine Ponytail, may I know why're you so keen to manipulate & exaggerate the issue? Marriage at such young age was very common in the ancient days. Why don't you ask your grandmas/grandpas? Ev ...

Where is the evidence to show that marriage with 9 year old was common in Arabia?

Even if it was, it is stiull immoral of mohd andf a spiritual and diveinely guided man woudl not have done it. Therfore Mohd could not have been a messenger from Allah.

peace