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Author: barney50

The evil that had blinded Muslims

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Post time 4-4-2007 09:01 PM | Show all posts

Reply #179 barney50's post

1)
Now this more like it. You accept that it is figment of their mind. Well, that is what their Ullamas had thought them. They had been told that if they fight in the cause of Allah by sucide bombing they would get the grace of Allah and would be send to paradise then any others. The souls that roam aboud are the ones whose time has yet to come from leaving earth. Have you not had experience of ghost [the spirit of dead people]? Do not pretend because the Malays are more prone to be possessed by these ghost whose life had been taken off suddenly such as accident, murder and sucide. You need to learn from experience masters then half baked ullamas

My answer:
If the Ulamas taught them, then they should not be called fake Ulamas..and you are one of them either a fake monk or a fake ulama.Because Islam didn't teach you to behave like that. Show me in the HOLY Quran where you should suicide bombing yourself in order to get into the heavens?.Nowhere.Furthermore, the Islam rejected those who suicide themselves like that.So, don't blame Allah, Muhammad and Islam for that!.

For the souls, Muslims believe that the ghosts are Satans. Because you should remember Satan said:

"I will mislead them, and I will create in them false desires; I will order them to slit the ears of cattle, and to deface the (fair) nature created by Allah." Whoever, forsaking Allah, takes satan for a friend, hath of a surety suffered a loss that is manifest."(SURAH A-NISA' 4:119)

The ghosts are Satans because they love to disturb the human by Allah permission. So that, the human will follow them not Allah.I believe the existence, but I don't believe that they are souls of the death men.

"Our Lord!" (they say), "Let not our hearts deviate now after Thou hast guided us, but grant us mercy from Thine own Presence; for Thou art the Grantor of bounties without measure."(Surah Al-Imran 3:8)
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2)
I asked you to show me the verse where Allah says "beside my Quran Muslims should refere to anotherr book call the hadith to understand my Quran". That is al I ask of you

My answer:
My goodness...all the verses I revealed to you explained already.Other that the Holy Quran, he sent down the Wisdom (Hadith) and :

"Allah did confer a great favour on the believers when He sent among them an apostle from among themselves, rehearsing unto them the Signs of Allah, sanctifying them, and instructing them in Scripture and Wisdom, while, before that, they had been in manifest error."(Surah Al-Imran 3:164)

And then with the Wisdom, Muhammad explained with Allah permission:

""O People of the Book! Now hath come unto you, making (things) clear unto you, Our Messenger, after the break in (the series of) our apostles, lest ye should say: "There came unto us no bringer of glad tidings and no warner (from evil)": But now hath come unto you a bringer of glad tidings and a warner (from evil). And Allah hath power over all things."(Surah Al-Maidah 5:19)

And Allah said:

"Obey Allah, and obey the Messenger, and beware (of evil): if ye do turn back, know ye that it is Our Messenger.s duty to proclaim (the message) in the clearest manner."(Surah Al-Maidah 5:92)

Obey Allah and the Messenger who makes things clear (explaining), which meant, you have to follow both.But the leader is the Quran.
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3)
Makes no sense. What God is Allah? He says punish the wrong doers who go against Islam and the he would again punish them in the hereafter. Now that is the most stupidest thing in Islam. First it says freewill then it says obey or you'll be punished with such severe punishment here then he wil burn you in hell fire. It is now very clear that with such threat Mohammed had manage to subdue and controlled the minds of his followers by these punishment here and the hereafter. This is phychology on the mind. He had played into the mind of his follewers and silly Musims did not know of his motif. I feel sorry for them. Now they have become mindless zombies who would act on the slightest click of fingers. No wonder you see even kids are used in their champaign against non Muslims. I see them picking up stones and throwing at soldiers. Looks like their future is uncertain by such behaviour.

My answer:
See...how stupid you are in understanding something that already explained.The laws are to control the human from commit the wrongdoing on earth which I have explained before because Allah said:

"Do no mischief on the earth, after it hath been set in order, but call on Him with fear and longing (in your hearts): for the Mercy of Allah is (always) near to those who do good."(Surah Al-A'raaf 7:56)

But, in order to control, of course the laws are needed as guidances.So, that you will prevent yourself from doing wrong and behave correctly, so that you won't be punished on the Hereafter.

It is freewill...the laws are there to follow so that you will behave correctly. If you doesn't follow the laws and behave badly, so isn't that enough to say, you caused yourself to be punished?.Then why blame Allah, Muhammad and Islam?.

I wonder if Hindusm has no laws for the followers.Then, will you call the followers or devotees as zombies too?.
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4)
What laws? A courting couple holding hand and walking is sin? As long as they do not srtip naked in the public and have a go how could that be a sin? The most Merciful and forgiving does not fit into verse 5:33. So, it is lie to delude the followers of Islam. For those who break the law of the country have punishment under the penal code and the judge would not say after this punishment when you die GOD will punish you again.

My answer:
Part of it I have explained above.

Yes, holding hand between a man and a woman is a sin.No matter in the public or in the unseen places, because it can cause you commit adultery.Allah said:

"Nor come nigh to adultery: for it is a shameful (deed) and an evil, opening the road (to other evils)."(Surah Al-Isra' 17:32)

But, Christian is stricter.Because even you set a vision to a woman, you will be called commit adultery!.So, in this case, not Islam has such law.

Allah is Merciful, that is why on the next verse He said:

"Except for those who repent before they fall into your power: in that case, know that Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful."(Surah Al-Maidah 5:34)
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5)
No, it is a wrong concept adopted from the Jewish talmud. GOD's work is done here on earth and now HE is only a wittness to all actions of mankind. Man would suffer for his own wrong doing and would enjoy if he repants and walk the right path. GOD would only come inot action again when the time comes to end this cycle and create a new beginning. Understand that if you do not know. Islam is wrong right from the start and is wrong till to this very day. You are trapped in your on dreams and I feel sorry for you and many others lie you

My answer:
Ahh...same method.Once failed to answer back, the best way by insulting the religion.I have asked you, what is the different with the karma...what you have done, you will get back.By the way my old man, four books confirming this, what do you want to say?.Either David or Moses or Jesus or Muhammad and any other prophets, all reminding the followers this. What do you want to say?.
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Post time 4-4-2007 09:42 PM | Show all posts

Reply #180 barney50's post

7)
What wealth? If he had bestowed why are the Uthopeans suffering from starvation? So it is lie. It is a saying " GOD helps those who help themselves" so that man would not become lazy like sloth. This is a life you had taken and it is you who have to slog it out in order to have desent life. Not wait for handouts from others or the government. If you do that then you future would become bleak. These are motivation from the elders of the older religions before Islam. Hoiw does the bird and animals survie here? They workd on their instinct and search for food and man have the 6 senses can do better. Use your brain and your body to earn a living. That is all is asked of mankind. Think of the creator in mind and thank HIM for providing you this body and do your work. Do not harm any other for selfish reasons but defend you family and your country when danger arise. These are words of wisdom from elders of the earlier religions. What does GOD want beside these?

My answer:

Stupid...He gives you the wealth and in order to get it, you have to work for it.Like you want eat, are you just sitting there and wait the food to fly into your mouth?.No, you have to use your brain, your hand to put the food into your mind. Allah gives the wealth, in order to get it, you have to work for it.That is why He said:

"..nor forget thy portion in this world: but do thou good, as Allah has been good to thee, and seek not (occasions for) mischief in the land: for Allah loves not those who do mischief."(Surah Al-Qasas 28:77)

Islam taught that working is a good deed..

"And when the Prayer is finished, then may ye disperse through the land, and seek of the Bounty of Allah. and celebrate the Praises of Allah often (and without stint): that ye may prosper."(Surah Al-Jumu'ah 62:10)

He doesn't say, you sit there and suddenly the wealth will be yours.Never!!.

See the animals...Allah provide the wealth for them, but to get them, they have to work for it too.

That's why I say..you misunderstood Islam teaching.
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8)
There should be no secret? Why should the end be a secret? Just say Islam or Allah does not know about the end.

1.The Krita yuga, which is the era of perfection, is 1,728,000 years in duration
2.Treta Yuga, in which dharma is reduced by one quarter, is three quarters as long, 1,296,000 years
3.Dvapara yuga, dharma is reduced to one half, and its length is only 864,000 years
4.Kali yuga, in which dharma is reduced to one quarter, lasts for only 432,000 years

So, when kali yuga ends there would be a new world again and the cycle of life will start again. It is very clear but as I have saoid earlier Allah is unaware of it because he could not be GOD. GOD would not keep this a secret. He created man and had tolld man all that has to be know to mankind. I'm sorry because you folow a religion that is so secretive like a cult. That is why I doubt your religious teachings which are concocted my kmen of the 7th century

My answer:
My goodness...explained and not understand the reason why Allah kept that as secret. Before the 42000 years end you will die before that. So, what for you have to follow all that?.You said that you will die on 71st birthday..what if you die earlier?.Think la..why Allah wants to keep that as secret.The calculation is just a calculation and you can create many prophecies upon this.But at the end only Allah the God knows when it will really happen.By the way, you are welcome for the last minute repent.I'm afraid that you don't have a chance to do that.Then, blame yourself..
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9)
No prophecy but a reality. Why are you afraid to know your death is coming? I'm not. Just say Islam and Muslims are ignorant of these and I'll accept it but do not give me baseless reasons. We are not stupid as those of the 7th century

My answer:
Good...Muslims not afraid to die because death is a must.Like I said before, you can believe the prophecy saying you will die on such date...but what if you die earlier than that?.At that time you will realize who is the most stupid one.
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10)
Do you think your sins would not fall on your children? Why do Malays say sumpah tujoh keturanan? Ever heard of the legand of Mashuri? How did id come by? Islam is a religion born from the belif of others and most it did not know but made own ideas and the result is what you see now. Just believe whatever is told without question and you'd be called a good Muslim but if you question you'll be branded a traitor to Islam and branded as khafir. Simple solution! And that my friend is Islam for yo

My answer:
That is a legend.Hahaha.Legend is like a story to relate with good moral value and etc. Islam has no such teaching.Yes...those who disobey the Messenger and Allah will be called a traitor. I wonder if a follower in Hindusm insults the religion, you will praise him or her.If you do that, clearly enough that you don't love your religion!.
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11)
What are you talking? Oh! I see shok sendiri kah? Islam was forcefull and used sword to spread in the beginning. Iqar, Persia and India was invaded and conquered by Muslims who forced their religion upon peole of thses countries. YOu cannot denny this truth not can you lie to the future generation about islam being peaceful. Period!

My answer:
Not syok sendiri. I am happy because I am able to show to the viewers that Islam is not forcing.And at the same time, I am able to show to them that whatever you have said upon Islam are all against Islamic teaching.You cannot deny that Islam never taught such thing!! .
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12)
The verse had come from Muslims own mouth. Muslims do not believe GOD can take menifestation and that makes your Allah weak.  But for us GOD is Al Powerfull who can take any form when He desires. The difference is the Shiahs have a different version of  hadith and Quran. See the different practice of Suffis, does not that show Islam has different teachings and practice? You are lying to protect your religion atany cost without realizing the truth. You have been living in lies  all throughtout your life as other Muslims and I wonder how long can you live with such lies. Sorry, you religion cannot bluff me with make believe verse.

My answer:

You failed to proof that the Quran said Allah is weak in the verse 2:255.HAHAHA

The Quran is one version but different translation.Many Mazhab in the religion is normal because it occurs in Christian also. But the different between the Islam and the Christian is we only have one version of the Quran with different translation.

Allah never asked the followers to break into pieces...


Don't tell me that throughout the world, the Hindus practicing same thing la.Don't try to close/cover the flaws la.

[ Last edited by  eastrun at 4-4-2007 09:50 PM ]
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 Author| Post time 5-4-2007 10:59 AM | Show all posts
Reply #181 eastrun's post

  1. :
  2. If the Ulamas taught them, then they should not be called fake Ulamas..and you are one of them either a fake monk or a fake ulama.Because Islam didn't teach you to behave like that. Show me in the HOLY Quran where you should suicide bombing yourself in order to get into the heavens?.Nowhere.Furthermore, the Islam rejected those who suicide themselves like that.So, don't blame Allah, Muhammad and Islam for that!.
Copy the Code


You don't get it do  you? The Quran and hadith written in the 7th century had been misinterpreted to accomadate the whimps and fancies of the religious bigots. Otherwise do you think the young men would just load themselves with TNT and blow up trains and buildings so that they would died taking with them a few hundred lives of others? But the initiations came form Mohammed. He had told his followers that dying in the cause of Allah would grant them paradise and enjoyment in the aftherlife. You cannot deny that can you ?

  1. For the souls, Muslims believe that the ghosts are Satans. Because you should remember Satan said:

  2. "I will mislead them, and I will create in them false desires; I will order them to slit the ears of cattle, and to deface the (fair) nature created by Allah." Whoever, forsaking Allah, takes satan for a friend, hath of a surety suffered a loss that is manifest."(SURAH A-NISA' 4:119)[/b]

  3. [b]Satan has better things to do then frighten young girls and boys. Spirits of the dead had been roaming this planes all the while and are still there and those who had experience in seeing their apprition can vouch for it. You may not believe it but the paranormal investigators would tell you that ghost exist as they had special equipments to proof of their claim. Why go further, I with my own eyes had seen a ghost when I was young. So, it is up to you to beieve it or not.[/b]

  4. [code] The ghosts are Satans because they love to disturb the human by Allah permission. So that, the human will follow them not Allah.I believe the existence, but I don't believe that they are souls of the death men.

  5. "Our Lord!" (they say), "Let not our hearts deviate now after Thou hast guided us, but grant us mercy from Thine own Presence; for Thou art the Grantor of bounties without measure."(Surah Al-Imran 3:8)[code]

  6. [b]Why are you so stuborn and ignorant on this matter. Ghosts are not Satan. Satan is the fallen angel and has better things to do then to knock on your window after midnight. Ghost are spirits of dead people who had yet to go into new borns because their time has not come. These ghost who roam this plane are people whose life had been taken abruptly. Satan on the other hand would only visit those who advocate on behalf of GOD. Because for Satan it is important to deal with such people in order to divert their mind so that these religious teachers would teach the doctorine of Satan in order to disturb the mind of the followers. That is what is happening in the world. Selected religious leaders comand a great influence over the followers and if such doctories are preached to them they would do any thing to disturb the peace of earth. Get my point? So Satan and Ghost are not the same.[/b]
  7. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  8. [code]:
  9. My goodness...all the verses I revealed to you explained already.Other that the Holy Quran, he sent down the Wisdom (Hadith) and :

  10. "Allah did confer a great favour on the believers when He sent among them an apostle from among themselves, rehearsing unto them the Signs of Allah, sanctifying them, and instructing them in Scripture and Wisdom, while, before that, they had been in manifest error."(Surah Al-Imran 3:164
Copy the Code


No specific reply? You are quoting ageneral statement or verse which could be interpreted in may ways. Where is the verse that says there is another book beside my own where you can get better understanding then my own book. Did Allah mentioned something to that effect? Wisdom can be found in the Quran itself if Muslims look deep into it but instead are looking into a man made condition called the hadith. Scripture itself is the wisdom for the follwers but no, they wanted the wisdom of Mohammed or may be it was the wisdom of the first caliph on how to conquer other nations and convert them to Islam. Is that the wisdom you are talking about?

  1. And then with the Wisdom, Muhammad explained with Allah permission:

  2. ""O People of the Book! Now hath come unto you, making (things) clear unto you, Our Messenger, after the break in (the series of) our apostles, lest ye should say: "There came unto us no bringer of glad tidings and no warner (from evil)": But now hath come unto you a bringer of glad tidings and a warner (from evil). And Allah hath power over all things."(Surah Al-Maidah 5:19)
Copy the Code


But these verse does not even say Allah has another book to look inot for wisdom.

  1. And Allah said:

  2. "Obey Allah, and obey the Messenger, and beware (of evil): if ye do turn back, know ye that it is Our Messenger.s duty to proclaim (the message) in the clearest manner."(Surah Al-Maidah 5:92)

  3. Obey Allah and the Messenger who makes things clear (explaining), which meant, you have to follow both.But the leader is the Quran.
Copy the Code


Another misinterpretation of Ullamas. Thsi verse actuall meant that obey GOD and his messange who came to depart my message. That is the simplest way to understand the Quran. It clearly says you have to believe the message he departs not make another book call the hadith and say it is the interpretation of the Quran. This is how Muslims over the centuries had been mislead and deluded from the truth
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 Author| Post time 5-4-2007 11:00 AM | Show all posts
Reply #181 eastrun's post

  1. :
  2. If the Ulamas taught them, then they should not be called fake Ulamas..and you are one of them either a fake monk or a fake ulama.Because Islam didn't teach you to behave like that. Show me in the HOLY Quran where you should suicide bombing yourself in order to get into the heavens?.Nowhere.Furthermore, the Islam rejected those who suicide themselves like that.So, don't blame Allah, Muhammad and Islam for that!.
Copy the Code


You don't get it do  you? The Quran and hadith written in the 7th century had been misinterpreted to accomadate the whimps and fancies of the religious bigots. Otherwise do you think the young men would just load themselves with TNT and blow up trains and buildings so that they would died taking with them a few hundred lives of others? But the initiations came form Mohammed. He had told his followers that dying in the cause of Allah would grant them paradise and enjoyment in the aftherlife. You cannot deny that can you ?

  1. For the souls, Muslims believe that the ghosts are Satans. Because you should remember Satan said:

  2. "I will mislead them, and I will create in them false desires; I will order them to slit the ears of cattle, and to deface the (fair) nature created by Allah." Whoever, forsaking Allah, takes satan for a friend, hath of a surety suffered a loss that is manifest."(SURAH A-NISA' 4:119)[/b]

  3. [b]Satan has better things to do then frighten young girls and boys. Spirits of the dead had been roaming this planes all the while and are still there and those who had experience in seeing their apprition can vouch for it. You may not believe it but the paranormal investigators would tell you that ghost exist as they had special equipments to proof of their claim. Why go further, I with my own eyes had seen a ghost when I was young. So, it is up to you to beieve it or not.[/b]

  4. [code] The ghosts are Satans because they love to disturb the human by Allah permission. So that, the human will follow them not Allah.I believe the existence, but I don't believe that they are souls of the death men.

  5. "Our Lord!" (they say), "Let not our hearts deviate now after Thou hast guided us, but grant us mercy from Thine own Presence; for Thou art the Grantor of bounties without measure."(Surah Al-Imran 3:8)[code]

  6. [b]Why are you so stuborn and ignorant on this matter. Ghosts are not Satan. Satan is the fallen angel and has better things to do then to knock on your window after midnight. Ghost are spirits of dead people who had yet to go into new borns because their time has not come. These ghost who roam this plane are people whose life had been taken abruptly. Satan on the other hand would only visit those who advocate on behalf of GOD. Because for Satan it is important to deal with such people in order to divert their mind so that these religious teachers would teach the doctorine of Satan in order to disturb the mind of the followers. That is what is happening in the world. Selected religious leaders comand a great influence over the followers and if such doctories are preached to them they would do any thing to disturb the peace of earth. Get my point? So Satan and Ghost are not the same.[/b]
  7. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  8. [code]:
  9. My goodness...all the verses I revealed to you explained already.Other that the Holy Quran, he sent down the Wisdom (Hadith) and :

  10. "Allah did confer a great favour on the believers when He sent among them an apostle from among themselves, rehearsing unto them the Signs of Allah, sanctifying them, and instructing them in Scripture and Wisdom, while, before that, they had been in manifest error."(Surah Al-Imran 3:164
Copy the Code


No specific reply? You are quoting ageneral statement or verse which could be interpreted in may ways. Where is the verse that says there is another book beside my own where you can get better understanding then my own book. Did Allah mentioned something to that effect? Wisdom can be found in the Quran itself if Muslims look deep into it but instead are looking into a man made condition called the hadith. Scripture itself is the wisdom for the follwers but no, they wanted the wisdom of Mohammed or may be it was the wisdom of the first caliph on how to conquer other nations and convert them to Islam. Is that the wisdom you are talking about?

  1. And then with the Wisdom, Muhammad explained with Allah permission:

  2. ""O People of the Book! Now hath come unto you, making (things) clear unto you, Our Messenger, after the break in (the series of) our apostles, lest ye should say: "There came unto us no bringer of glad tidings and no warner (from evil)": But now hath come unto you a bringer of glad tidings and a warner (from evil). And Allah hath power over all things."(Surah Al-Maidah 5:19)
Copy the Code


But these verse does not even say Allah has another book to look inot for wisdom.

  1. And Allah said:

  2. "Obey Allah, and obey the Messenger, and beware (of evil): if ye do turn back, know ye that it is Our Messenger.s duty to proclaim (the message) in the clearest manner."(Surah Al-Maidah 5:92)

  3. Obey Allah and the Messenger who makes things clear (explaining), which meant, you have to follow both.But the leader is the Quran.
Copy the Code


Another misinterpretation of Ullamas. Thsi verse actuall meant that obey GOD and his messange who came to depart my message. That is the simplest way to understand the Quran. It clearly says you have to believe the message he departs not make another book call the hadith and say it is the interpretation of the Quran. This is how Muslims over the centuries had been mislead and deluded from the truth
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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 Author| Post time 5-4-2007 11:01 AM | Show all posts
Reply #181 eastrun's post

  1. :
  2. If the Ulamas taught them, then they should not be called fake Ulamas..and you are one of them either a fake monk or a fake ulama.Because Islam didn't teach you to behave like that. Show me in the HOLY Quran where you should suicide bombing yourself in order to get into the heavens?.Nowhere.Furthermore, the Islam rejected those who suicide themselves like that.So, don't blame Allah, Muhammad and Islam for that!.
Copy the Code


You don't get it do  you? The Quran and hadith written in the 7th century had been misinterpreted to accomadate the whimps and fancies of the religious bigots. Otherwise do you think the young men would just load themselves with TNT and blow up trains and buildings so that they would died taking with them a few hundred lives of others? But the initiations came form Mohammed. He had told his followers that dying in the cause of Allah would grant them paradise and enjoyment in the aftherlife. You cannot deny that can you ?

  1. For the souls, Muslims believe that the ghosts are Satans. Because you should remember Satan said:

  2. "I will mislead them, and I will create in them false desires; I will order them to slit the ears of cattle, and to deface the (fair) nature created by Allah." Whoever, forsaking Allah, takes satan for a friend, hath of a surety suffered a loss that is manifest."(SURAH A-NISA' 4:119)[/b]

  3. [b]Satan has better things to do then frighten young girls and boys. Spirits of the dead had been roaming this planes all the while and are still there and those who had experience in seeing their apprition can vouch for it. You may not believe it but the paranormal investigators would tell you that ghost exist as they had special equipments to proof of their claim. Why go further, I with my own eyes had seen a ghost when I was young. So, it is up to you to beieve it or not.[/b]

  4. [code] The ghosts are Satans because they love to disturb the human by Allah permission. So that, the human will follow them not Allah.I believe the existence, but I don't believe that they are souls of the death men.

  5. "Our Lord!" (they say), "Let not our hearts deviate now after Thou hast guided us, but grant us mercy from Thine own Presence; for Thou art the Grantor of bounties without measure."(Surah Al-Imran 3:8)[code]

  6. [b]Why are you so stuborn and ignorant on this matter. Ghosts are not Satan. Satan is the fallen angel and has better things to do then to knock on your window after midnight. Ghost are spirits of dead people who had yet to go into new borns because their time has not come. These ghost who roam this plane are people whose life had been taken abruptly. Satan on the other hand would only visit those who advocate on behalf of GOD. Because for Satan it is important to deal with such people in order to divert their mind so that these religious teachers would teach the doctorine of Satan in order to disturb the mind of the followers. That is what is happening in the world. Selected religious leaders comand a great influence over the followers and if such doctories are preached to them they would do any thing to disturb the peace of earth. Get my point? So Satan and Ghost are not the same.[/b]
  7. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  8. [code]:
  9. My goodness...all the verses I revealed to you explained already.Other that the Holy Quran, he sent down the Wisdom (Hadith) and :

  10. "Allah did confer a great favour on the believers when He sent among them an apostle from among themselves, rehearsing unto them the Signs of Allah, sanctifying them, and instructing them in Scripture and Wisdom, while, before that, they had been in manifest error."(Surah Al-Imran 3:164
Copy the Code


No specific reply? You are quoting ageneral statement or verse which could be interpreted in may ways. Where is the verse that says there is another book beside my own where you can get better understanding then my own book. Did Allah mentioned something to that effect? Wisdom can be found in the Quran itself if Muslims look deep into it but instead are looking into a man made condition called the hadith. Scripture itself is the wisdom for the follwers but no, they wanted the wisdom of Mohammed or may be it was the wisdom of the first caliph on how to conquer other nations and convert them to Islam. Is that the wisdom you are talking about?

  1. And then with the Wisdom, Muhammad explained with Allah permission:

  2. ""O People of the Book! Now hath come unto you, making (things) clear unto you, Our Messenger, after the break in (the series of) our apostles, lest ye should say: "There came unto us no bringer of glad tidings and no warner (from evil)": But now hath come unto you a bringer of glad tidings and a warner (from evil). And Allah hath power over all things."(Surah Al-Maidah 5:19)
Copy the Code


But these verse does not even say Allah has another book to look inot for wisdom.

  1. And Allah said:

  2. "Obey Allah, and obey the Messenger, and beware (of evil): if ye do turn back, know ye that it is Our Messenger.s duty to proclaim (the message) in the clearest manner."(Surah Al-Maidah 5:92)

  3. Obey Allah and the Messenger who makes things clear (explaining), which meant, you have to follow both.But the leader is the Quran.
Copy the Code


Another misinterpretation of Ullamas. Thsi verse actuall meant that obey GOD and his messange who came to depart my message. That is the simplest way to understand the Quran. It clearly says you have to believe the message he departs not make another book call the hadith and say it is the interpretation of the Quran. This is how Muslims over the centuries had been mislead and deluded from the truth
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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 Author| Post time 5-4-2007 11:03 AM | Show all posts
sambungan:

  1. :

  2. See...how stupid you are in understanding something that already
  3. explained.The laws are to control the human from commit the wrongdoing
  4. on earth which I have explained before because Allah said:



  5. "Do no mischief on the earth, after it hath been set in order, but call
  6. on Him with fear and longing (in your hearts): for the Mercy of Allah
  7. is (always) near to those who do good."(Surah Al-A'raaf 7:56)
Copy the Code


Mischief can mean anything. Joking is mischief too so for joking youthink Allah would send you to hellfire? There are laws in our penalcode that punishes criminals according to its degree. Religious wrongdoingsw are a different matters totally. Such as going against itsteachings like breaking away from the fold is a sin as per Quranictext. But for that it would be ones own downfall in spiritual aspectand not a criminal offence. Rape is a sin not only in Islam but incriminal law too. Cheating whic also relate to white collar,  crimesand all other matter commited against others are punishable under thepenal code. So when we have al that is neccessary to rule a country,why do we nedda religious government that practice madivel law adoptedfrom the Arabic culture?

  1. But, in order to control, of course the laws are needed as
  2. guidances.So, that you will prevent yourself from doing wrong and
  3. behave correctly, so that you won't be punished on the Hereafter.
Copy the Code


Weather you'd be punished in the hereafter is just a believe and notsomething that anyone could rely on. Do not play with peoples mind byusing GOD and imaginary ground of judgement day that no one knows whenit will be.

  1. It is freewill...the laws are there to follow so that you will
  2. behave correctly. If you doesn't follow the laws and behave badly, so
  3. isn't that enough to say, you caused yourself to be punished?.Then why
  4. blame Allah, Muhammad and Islam?.



  5. I wonder if Hindusm has no laws for the followers.Then, will you call the followers or devotees as zombies too?.
Copy the Code


You do not get the picture do you? These so called laws were adoptedfrom the trible culture of Arabs. Nothing to do with GOD. Religiouslywhen we speak of freewill is weather on wishes to adhere to its laws ofspiritual awakening. In todays world we have laws legistated by expertsfrom law faculty and geberally accepted by all walks of life. Whereasreligious laws are only for those who suscribe to it and cannot beapplied on others. Hinduism has its spiruitual laws and those who donot follow are not punished here or the hereafter because Hinduimsbelieve that you commit sin you will pay for it. Morever, in India suchlaws are not in use for the general public because India is a secularnation with its own penal codes under the constitution. A religiousbody lime Islam do not have experts in the field of forsenic andgathering evidence to proof any criminal act. Islam does not mnentionany things in regards to that nor have any DNA testing mentioned in theQuran. So, it is absurd to argue on the point that Islamic law is forall. I have proven my point here and you are left with emptiness inyour thoughts on this matter.
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  1. :

  2. Part of it I have explained above.



  3. Yes, holding hand between a man and a woman is a sin.No matter in the
  4. public or in the unseen places, because it can cause you commit
  5. adultery.Allah said:



  6. "Nor come nigh to adultery: for it is a shameful (deed) and an evil,
  7. opening the road (to other evils)."(Surah Al-Isra' 17:32)
Copy the Code


What makes you think that holding hands would lead to evil. When Iwas courting I use to hold my girlfriend's hand in the public. It didnot lead to any evil. What is evil in the Muslims eye may not be evilto others. If you have groomed your children according to yourscripture why then are you afraid that that they would stray? May beyour children do not believe in the teachings of Islam and that is whyyou see so many cases of buang bayi. May be the Quran is being thoughtwrongly in the class ugama that these children wanted to experimentwhat you forbid. Muslim children are in a dilemma and this had leadthem to stray. Blame your religious teachers and the religion for theconfusion instead of blaming others.

  1. But, Christian is stricter.Because even you set a vision to a
  2. woman, you will be called commit adultery!.So, in this case, not Islam
  3. has such law.



  4. Allah is Merciful, that is why on the next verse He said:



  5. "Except for those who repent before they fall into your power: in that
  6. case, know that Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful."(Surah Al-Maidah
  7. 5:34)
Copy the Code


No, you are wrong. May be you are talking Christianity during theperiod of the crusaders. I do not see or heard that such an act wouldbe punished b Christian chruches. They too believe that what you sinnow would be punished in the here after and that was what Moahmmedadded to his teachings in Islam.
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  1. :

  2. Ahh...same method.Once failed to answer back, the best way by insulting
  3. the religion.I have asked you, what is the different with the
  4. karma...what you have done, you will get back.By the way my old man,
  5. four books confirming this, what do you want to say?.Either David or
  6. Moses or Jesus or Muhammad and any other prophets, all reminding the
  7. followers this. What do you want to say?.
Copy the Code


David, Moses and Jesus were all Jews from the same branch butMohammed, I don't think so. Mohammed may have claimed that Islam is thecontinuation of the OT but Jews did not accept such gimmics created byMohammed. Mohammed is an Arab and wanting to reform his pagan religionhe adopted the OT to justify his calim ofr prophethood.
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 Author| Post time 5-4-2007 11:59 AM | Show all posts
Reply  #182 eastrun's post

  1. :



  2. Stupid...He gives you the wealth and in order to get it, you have to
  3. work for it.Like you want eat, are you just sitting there and wait the
  4. food to fly into your mouth?.No, you have to use your brain, your hand
  5. to put the food into your mind. Allah gives the wealth, in order to get
  6. it, you have to work for it.That is why He said:

  7. "..nor forget thy portion in this world: but do thou good, as Allah has
  8. been good to thee, and seek not (occasions for) mischief in the land:
  9. for Allah loves not those who do mischief."(Surah Al-Qasas 28:77)
Copy the Code


You are the most stupidest person I have ever come across here. How could the Eutopians live in land that cannot grow anything because there is no rainfall? What can they work on with? You must be one stupid Muslim who think in  a stupid way. What can people in war torn Dafur do to survive? Have you  thought of all these? GOD did not provide wealth nor suffering to anyone. It is the Karma of the Eutopians that they are born in the GOD foresaken place to suffer. May be these are the souls of Arabs of the 7th century who mistreated the pagans and now paying the price of their bad karma. How is that for logic?


  1. Islam taught that working is a good deed..



  2. "And when the Prayer is finished, then may ye disperse through the
  3. land, and seek of the Bounty of Allah. and celebrate the Praises of
  4. Allah often (and without stint): that ye may prosper."(Surah Al-Jumu'ah
  5. 62:10)

  6. He doesn't say, you sit there and suddenly the wealth will be yours.Never!!.

  7. See the animals...Allah provide the wealth for them, but to get them, they have to work for it too.

  8. That's why I say..you misunderstood Islam teaching.
Copy the Code


I did not misunderstand but it is Muslims who had misunderstood the interpretation of the Quran. [/code]

Ethiopia:
  • 2.5 million people in Ethiopia are are in urgent need of humanitarian assistance.
  • Some rain has fallen but the effect of this is not yet clear.
Kenya:
  • 3.5 million in need of food aid.
  • 80% of the land is arid or semi-arid and is mainly pastoral.
  • People have experienced 5-6 seasons of poor/failed rains.

July 27, 2005
                                Niger, Africa梉/b]Malnutritionand mortality rates are critically high among children under five inMaradi and Zinder regions where World Vision operates area developmentprograms. More than three children per 10,000 under age five are dyingdaily from malnutrition reports Sarah Carr, a Canadian nutritionistserving in Niger. According to international standards, under-fivemortality rates of 2/10,000 children per day indicates an emergency;4/10,000 indicates a severe situation.


From the above I do not see Allah has given any wealth to these nations? Any explanation from an expert like you?


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My answer
  1. My goodness...explained and not understand the reason why Allah kept
  2. that as secret. Before the 42000 years end you will die before that.
  3. So, what for you have to follow all that?.You said that you will die on
  4. 71st birthday..what if you die earlier?.Think la..why Allah wants to
  5. keep that as secret.The calculation is just a calculation and you can
  6. create many prophecies upon this.But at the end only Allah the God
  7. knows when it will really happen.By the way, you are welcome for the
  8. last minute repent.I'm afraid that you don't have a chance to do
  9. that.Then, blame yourself..
Copy the Code


In that case all those who live now would die before judgement day so why believe in that? Nothing to think because Allah could not be specific nor was he able to tell of the time the world would end. Allah that you  believe has no knowledge of such and so could not tell his prophet. No need for excuse as your Quran has nothing to back up judgement day.

  1. :

  2. Good...Muslims not afraid to die because death is a must.Like I said
  3. before, you can believe the prophecy saying you will die on such
  4. date...but what if you die earlier than that?.At that time you will
  5. realize who is the most stupid one.
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I know my death so why should I worry of dying earlier? My life had been fixed and I'm glad that I know when my death is coming but as for you, you have to live in fear because not knowing it is like guessing. May be tomorrow or the next or in two years time or may be fall sick and bedridden for the next 10 years and die without any assistance. All thse kind of guessingwould crop into your mind. A fearfull life of uncertainity. That is what Muslims had been put to suffer in agony notknowing how will death coem to them. But it comes short or by tragic I hear them saying ini semua takhdir. Which means they believe in fate.
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  1. :

  2. That is a legend.Hahaha.Legend is like a story to relate with good
  3. moral value and etc. Islam has no such teaching.Yes...those who disobey
  4. the Messenger and Allah will be called a traitor. I wonder if a
  5. follower in Hindusm insults the religion, you will praise him or her.If
  6. you do that, clearly enough that you don't love your religion!.
Copy the Code


Another baseless excuse from eastrun who has run out of bullets. I feel sorry for you but that is your fate to accept the untruth.
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  1. :

  2. Not syok sendiri. I am happy because I am able to show to the viewers
  3. that Islam is not forcing.And at the same time, I am able to show to
  4. them that whatever you have said upon Islam are all against Islamic
  5. teaching.You cannot deny that Islam never taught such thing!!
Copy the Code


So, you did not study history in school.  That proves your ignorance. You have proved nothing but cocked up stories which has no validation except what it says in the Quran. I can understand your weakness. .
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  1. :

  2. You failed to proof that the Quran said Allah is weak in the verse 2:255.HAHAHA

  3. The Quran is one version but different translation.Many Mazhab in the
  4. religion is normal because it occurs in Christian also. But the
  5. different between the Islam and the Christian is we only have one
  6. version of the Quran with different translation.

  7. Allah never asked the followers to break into pieces...
Copy the Code


Why is there differnt tounge? The Allah who says that people should only follow in way should have also created people of one race and one language but he did not do that and can you tell me why is that so?


  1. Don't tell me that throughout the world, the Hindus practicing same thing la.Don't try to close/cover the flaws la.
Copy the Code


But we are not fighting like you? Shaih accusing Sunnis of wrong practice and other sects having problem with each other on the practice and calling each other kafirs. All these are happening because of misinterpretation of the Quran by various sects. So the problem of religion is with Muslims and not any others. You are painting a picture of butter and honey but that is not the real picture. See the amount of daily killing by Sunnis against Shiats and Shiats killing Sunnis. Iraq, Afghanista and Pakistan are some of the good example. Problematic religion for problemmatic people. Hahahahaha!
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Post time 5-4-2007 06:29 PM | Show all posts

Reply #183 barney50's post

1)
You don't get it do  you? The Quran and hadith written in the 7th century had been misinterpreted to accomadate the whimps and fancies of the religious bigots. Otherwise do you think the young men would just load themselves with TNT and blow up trains and buildings so that they would died taking with them a few hundred lives of others? But the initiations came form Mohammed. He had told his followers that dying in the cause of Allah would grant them paradise and enjoyment in the aftherlife. You cannot deny that can you ?

My answer:
Well..since you claimed like that, that is why I asked you to show from the Holy Quran whether Allah asked the followers to suicide bombing in order to get into the paradise or not.The Quran was written 1400 years ago..you assumed that the bigots had misinterpreted the scriptures, but why don't you count that for your scriptures, which existed thousands years before Quran?.They are not misinterpreted by your bigots?.In that length of period, you can imagine, how many times your bigots keep changing the scriptures.Why don't you count for that?. And Muhammad never told the followers to suicide bombing to sacrifice for God. You created it!.
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2)
No specific reply? You are quoting ageneral statement or verse which could be interpreted in may ways. Where is the verse that says there is another book beside my own where you can get better understanding then my own book. Did Allah mentioned something to that effect? Wisdom can be found in the Quran itself if Muslims look deep into it but instead are looking into a man made condition called the hadith. Scripture itself is the wisdom for the follwers but no, they wanted the wisdom of Mohammed or may be it was the wisdom of the first caliph on how to conquer other nations and convert them to Islam. Is that the wisdom you are talking about?

My answer:
Why are you so hard to understand?.Read the verses, Allah sent the Scripture and the Hadith (WISDOM). And Muhammad was sent to make things clear with the Wisdom that Allah had given to him in order to explain the Quran PHYSICALLY and briefer so that the followers can understand better. All prophets did the same thing.Yes, Wisdom can be found in the Holy Quran, like the laws and etc. But Muhammad was sent to show how to implement  the laws,how to solat, and etc..PHYSICALLY.
And I told you the WISDOM is related with the Scripture and the Scripture is the leader.So follow both but refer to the Quran.
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3)
But these verse does not even say Allah has another book to look inot for wisdom.

My answer:

"Make things clear..."..that meant the Wisdom of Muhammad to explain.Which Allah sent together with the scripture.
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4)
Another misinterpretation of Ullamas. Thsi verse actuall meant that obey GOD and his messange who came to depart my message. That is the simplest way to understand the Quran. It clearly says you have to believe the message he departs not make another book call the hadith and say it is the interpretation of the Quran. This is how Muslims over the centuries had been mislead and deluded from the truth

My answer:
You mislead yourself. How many time I have to tell you...that He sent Wisdom beside the Scripture to Muhammad. He sent down two things. Since those two things, initially came from Him, so we have to follow.But He said the Scripture and the Wisdom...He put the word Scripture in front the word Wisdom, meaning that the Scripture is the leader between those two.You have to follow both!.
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5)
Mischief can mean anything. Joking is mischief too so for joking youthink Allah would send you to hellfire? There are laws in our penalcode that punishes criminals according to its degree. Religious wrongdoingsw are a different matters totally. Such as going against itsteachings like breaking away from the fold is a sin as per Quranictext. But for that it would be ones own downfall in spiritual aspectand not a criminal offence. Rape is a sin not only in Islam but incriminal law too. Cheating whic also relate to white collar,  crimesand all other matter commited against others are punishable under thepenal code. So when we have al that is neccessary to rule a country,why do we nedda religious government that practice madivel law adoptedfrom the Arabic culture.

My answer:
Why not?.As long as the laws can help to make people behave better, why not?.Answer me!.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
6)
You do not get the picture do you? These so called laws were adoptedfrom the trible culture of Arabs. Nothing to do with GOD. Religiouslywhen we speak of freewill is weather on wishes to adhere to its laws ofspiritual awakening. In todays world we have laws legistated by expertsfrom law faculty and geberally accepted by all walks of life. Whereasreligious laws are only for those who suscribe to it and cannot beapplied on others. Hinduism has its spiruitual laws and those who donot follow are not punished here or the hereafter because Hinduimsbelieve that you commit sin you will pay for it. Morever, in India suchlaws are not in use for the general public because India is a secularnation with its own penal codes under the constitution. A religiousbody lime Islam do not have experts in the field of forsenic andgathering evidence to proof any criminal act. Islam does not mnentionany things in regards to that nor have any DNA testing mentioned in theQuran. So, it is absurd to argue on the point that Islamic law is forall. I have proven my point here and you are left with emptiness inyour thoughts on this matter.

My answer:
Do you meant the Syariah Court applied to the non believers too?.No..It applies to the Muslims and Islam.The laws are from God, even the Hindusm laws, or the government laws also can be said that, because God is the Creator of All.Hindusm believe in karma..you do that, you will be repaid like what you have done.What is the difference about the Islamic law?...the good things to see are why the laws are created...Of course to control the human from wrongdoings.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[ Last edited by  eastrun at 5-4-2007 07:06 PM ]
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Post time 5-4-2007 06:56 PM | Show all posts

Reply #186 barney50's post

8)
What makes you think that holding hands would lead to evil. When Iwas courting I use to hold my girlfriend's hand in the public. It didnot lead to any evil. What is evil in the Muslims eye may not be evilto others. If you have groomed your children according to yourscripture why then are you afraid that that they would stray? May beyour children do not believe in the teachings of Islam and that is whyyou see so many cases of buang bayi. May be the Quran is being thoughtwrongly in the class ugama that these children wanted to experimentwhat you forbid. Muslim children are in a dilemma and this had leadthem to stray. Blame your religious teachers and the religion for theconfusion instead of blaming others.

My answer:
That is because they don't follow the Quran.Quran said don't do these, but they do.So, either Quran or Ulama or Muhammad or Allah or Islam are not to be blamed in this case.

Of course la...In Islam, holding hands with your girlfriend is wrong.Then, why you make that kind of mess?.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
8)
No, you are wrong. May be you are talking Christianity during theperiod of the crusaders. I do not see or heard that such an act wouldbe punished b Christian chruches. They too believe that what you sinnow would be punished in the here after and that was what Moahmmedadded to his teachings in Islam.

My answer:
Oh really...ask your CHRISTIAN friends and have a look in the book of Matthew before you make further commentary about this.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
9)
David, Moses and Jesus were all Jews from the same branch butMohammed, I don't think so. Mohammed may have claimed that Islam is thecontinuation of the OT but Jews did not accept such gimmics created byMohammed. Mohammed is an Arab and wanting to reform his pagan religionhe adopted the OT to justify his calim ofr prophethood.

My answer:
Then, what about Noah, Syuaib, Jonah and etc.They are NOT Jews you know. So, what is the problem when Muhammad, an Arab was chosen as one of the prophets?.You are reading the Bible but in your mind that the Bible only talk about the Jews.You are wrong my friend.You are totally wrong!.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
10)
You are the most stupidest person I have ever come across here. How could the Eutopians live in land that cannot grow anything because there is no rainfall? What can they work on with? You must be one stupid Muslim who think in  a stupid way. What can people in war torn Dafur do to survive? Have you  thought of all these? GOD did not provide wealth nor suffering to anyone. It is the Karma of the Eutopians that they are born in the GOD foresaken place to suffer. May be these are the souls of Arabs of the 7th century who mistreated the pagans and now paying the price of their bad karma. How is that for logic?

My answer:
If the land cannot grow anything, how can there are still got Ethopians live there?.Nowhere in the world that no rainfall.AnD Allah said the wealth is everywhere, you have to find yourself. The earth is big AND WIDE.Since you cannot live there, then leave the place and move to other place.Who knows your wealth is not there but at other places?.You are very stupid in this.That is why Allah said you have to search!:

"And when the Prayer is finished, then may ye disperse through the
land, and seek of the Bounty of Allah. and celebrate the Praises of
Allah often (and without stint): that ye may prosper."(Surah Al-Jumu'ah
62:10)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
11)
I did not misunderstand but it is Muslims who had misunderstood the interpretation of the Quran. [/code]

Ethiopia:

    * 2.5 million people in Ethiopia are are in urgent need of humanitarian assistance.
    * Some rain has fallen but the effect of this is not yet clear.

Kenya:

    * 3.5 million in need of food aid.
    * 80% of the land is arid or semi-arid and is mainly pastoral.
    * People have experienced 5-6 seasons of poor/failed rains.


July 27, 2005
                                Niger, Africa桵alnutritionand mortality rates are critically high among children under five inMaradi and Zinder regions where World Vision operates area developmentprograms. More than three children per 10,000 under age five are dyingdaily from malnutrition reports Sarah Carr, a Canadian nutritionistserving in Niger. According to international standards, under-fivemortality rates of 2/10,000 children per day indicates an emergency;4/10,000 indicates a severe situation.

My answer:
I have answered above
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
12)
In that case all those who live now would die before judgement day so why believe in that? Nothing to think because Allah could not be specific nor was he able to tell of the time the world would end. Allah that you  believe has no knowledge of such and so could not tell his prophet. No need for excuse as your Quran has nothing to back up judgement day.

My answer:
That is different . Because the Day Judgement will happen but not clear when.So, the best way is by repenting frequently and that is the reason Allah kept that as secret!. The best answer only God knows when the Judgement Day and the death will come.We can prophecy and calculate, the actual date or time, Only Allah Knows!.Muhammad did gave a logic answer!
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13)
I know my death so why should I worry of dying earlier? My life had been fixed and I'm glad that I know when my death is coming but as for you, you have to live in fear because not knowing it is like guessing. May be tomorrow or the next or in two years time or may be fall sick and bedridden for the next 10 years and die without any assistance. All thse kind of guessingwould crop into your mind. A fearfull life of uncertainity. That is what Muslims had been put to suffer in agony notknowing how will death coem to them. But it comes short or by tragic I hear them saying ini semua takhdir. Which means they believe in fate.

My answer:
It is only a calculation and prophecy.You don't know the actual time.So, please repent.The guessing makes you remember  God always and you will repent always.Which will make you become a better person.Takdir..Yes it is fate of Allah.Allah already decided which time we should die, but He kept as secret, so that we can repent always.Because we doesn't know whether the death is near or not!.

"
Verily, all things have We created in proportion and measure."(Surah Al-Qamar 54:49)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
14)(
So, you did not study history in school.  That proves your ignorance. You have proved nothing but cocked up stories which has no validation except what it says in the Quran. I can understand your weakness.

My answer:
You are talking fake..and against Islamic teaching.I am glad that I have chance to reveal it to the viewers.

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15)
Why is there differnt tounge? The Allah who says that people should only follow in way should have also created people of one race and one language but he did not do that and can you tell me why is that so?

My answer:
And don't tell me that the Vedas were translated by a translator only. So will you say that when you read the translated Vedas in Malay, you are going stray from the mother tounge?.So, it is translated different language by different translator, but talking about same thing.No where in Al-Quran Allah called WEAK.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
16)
But we are not fighting like you? Shaih accusing Sunnis of wrong practice and other sects having problem with each other on the practice and calling each other kafirs. All these are happening because of misinterpretation of the Quran by various sects. So the problem of religion is with Muslims and not any others. You are painting a picture of butter and honey but that is not the real picture. See the amount of daily killing by Sunnis against Shiats and Shiats killing Sunnis. Iraq, Afghanista and Pakistan are some of the good example. Problematic religion for problemmatic people. Hahahahaha!

My answer:
But, that is not the Islamic teaching. So, Islam has nothing to do with what they have done. The reason that happened is because the don't follow the Scripture and the Wisdom Allah sent down.

You are not fighting?.You are fighting about faith also because your religion also has different sects.Your religion also failed to make up in to one faith, then you want to comment about the other religions..You just cannot cover that, Barney.


[ Last edited by  eastrun at 5-4-2007 07:09 PM ]
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 Author| Post time 6-4-2007 07:44 AM | Show all posts
Reply #188 eastrun's post

  1. :
  2. Well..since you claimed like that, that is why I asked you to show from the Holy Quran whether Allah asked the followers to suicide bombing in order to get into the paradise or not.The Quran was written 1400 years ago..you assumed that the bigots had misinterpreted the scriptures, but why don't you count that for your scriptures, which existed thousands years before Quran?.They are not misinterpreted by your bigots?.In that length of period, you can imagine, how many times your bigots keep changing the scriptures.Why don't you count for that?. And Muhammad never told the followers to suicide bombing to sacrifice for God. You created it!.
Copy the Code


Although it is not there directly but indirectly the clerics of Islam had instiated and groomed young Muslims to commit sucide bombing in the name of Islam and Allah. The fro such an act would be  paradise and enjoyment of the best of the best. Read this confession of a would be sucide bomber:

Would-be suicide bomber tells of quest for 'paradise'

Hainuallah's days in a destitute border village in Pakistan all seemed
exactly the same: a trip to the madrasa (religious school), the return
home, dinner, and then creeping into bed.

Of course it was boring, says the Pakistani teenager from the border
province of Waziristan.

Then one day, a preacher told him about a way out of the boredom -- a
sure ticket to a paradise filled with voluptuous virgin nymphs and milk
and honey running under fruit-laden trees.

"I came to Afghanistan to carry out a suicide attack on Americans,"
Hainuallah, who uses only one name, told an Agence France-Presse (AFP)
reporter.

"The mullah said it would earn me entry into Paradise where you live
with houris [virgin nymphs] and streams of milk and honey forever."
The dishevelled young man with a few soft hairs on his chin, wearing a
grimy traditional shalwar kamiz, was presented to AFP in an underground
cell inside the Afghan Intelligence Department in the capital, Kabul.

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  1. :
  2. Why are you so hard to understand?.Read the verses, Allah sent the Scripture and the Hadith (WISDOM). And Muhammad was sent to make things clear with the Wisdom that Allah had given to him in order to explain the Quran PHYSICALLY and briefer so that the followers can understand better. All prophets did the same thing.Yes, Wisdom can be found in the Holy Quran, like the laws and etc. But Muhammad was sent to show how to implement  the laws,how to solat, and etc..PHYSICALLY.
  3. And I told you the WISDOM is related with the Scripture and the Scripture is the leader.So follow both but refer to the Quran.
Copy the Code


This is an excuse to use hadith. Yes, this is the excuse Muslims use in order to use the hadith is all aspect fo Islam. Allah did not mentioed anything about any other book but it was the Muslis cleric who say so and eastrun just follow these clerics interpretation in order that Muslism would accept the hadith as word of GOD too. This is a utter lie and you are accepting lies.
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  1. :

  2. "Make things clear..."..that meant the Wisdom of Muhammad to explain.Which Allah sent together with the scripture.
Copy the Code


Mohammed was told to part with the messages given by Gaberial and not  anything beside that. Muslim cleric and the caliphs aftehr the death of Mohammed created this hadith and said it is the sunnah of the prophet that all must accept and use in their daily life. So, the Quran was put a aside and the use of hadith became the comon practice of Muslims.
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  1. :
  2. You mislead yourself. How many time I have to tell you...that He sent Wisdom beside the Scripture to Muhammad. He sent down two things. Since those two things, initially came from Him, so we have to follow.But He said the Scripture and the Wisdom...He put the word Scripture in front the word Wisdom, meaning that the Scripture is the leader between those two.You have to follow both!.
Copy the Code


No he did not, He only departed with messages that are stated in the Quran. He aslo said that he had made the Quran so easy to understand and so no other books would be created to explain mine. Read the Quran  again to understand its meaning.
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  1. :
  2. Why not?.As long as the laws can help to make people behave better, why not?.Answer me!.
Copy the Code


No, it cannot and I have given the reason. Our secular law was legislated to accomadate all irrespective of race and religion. Whereas Islamic syariah law was only meant for Muslims adopted from the nomadic culture of Arabs. It cannot be compeled on non Arabs because we are not nomadic tribes.
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  1. Do you meant the Syariah Court applied to the non believers too?.No..It applies to the Muslims and Islam.The laws are from God, even the Hindusm laws, or the government laws also can be said that, because God is the Creator of All.Hindusm believe in karma..you do that, you will be repaid like what you have done.What is the difference about the Islamic law?...the good things to see are why the laws are created...Of course to control the human from wrong doings.
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It is now slowly trying to inflitrated the non Muslim society. Anyway in Islamic countries these syariah laws are forcefully applied on non Muslim foreign workers. It may or may not be from GOD but it was meant for Muslims of Arab decendants. Just like the Jewish laws applied to Jews. Anyway, these so called GOD's law was meant for the period of time it was created and is now outdated. Passed the period of time because it does not have traffic laws, copyright act, computer frauds, security commission laws, drug laws and many more laws to come in years from now. Allah nor Mohamme did not foresee such changes in the progress of mankind in the future and so applied what was needed for that particular period. This, I think Muslims fail to see and are stuck in time.
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 Author| Post time 6-4-2007 11:41 AM | Show all posts
Reply #189 eastrun's post


  1. :
  2. That is because they don't follow the Quran.Quran said don't do these, but they do.So, either Quran or Ulama or Muhammad or Allah or Islam are not to be blamed in this case.

  3. Of course la...In Islam, holding hands with your girlfriend is wrong.Then, why you make that kind of mess?.
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That is a stupid statement coming from the so called Islamic expert. As I have said earlier Islam is a religion of the desert people and living a normadic life would not know about such thing as friendship and love. Mohammed knowing how these nomadic people deal with women in their time decided to bring this laws. May be these desert people use to have sex before marriage and there were too many babies dumped around the desert. Mohammed decided to punish such people and so brought this law. May be the Arab men could not stand seeing a woman beside him. Arab men are so lustful that they cannot stay without having sex. What else a nomad would do in a desert life. So, such laws were needed to control the sexual desires of Arabs. May be eating too much camel meat and drinking camels milk had driven these Arabs to commit rape the moment the lay their eyes on young maidens. But I do not see anything wrong as long as they are true friendship and trusted love.
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  1. :
  2. Oh really...ask your CHRISTIAN friends and have a look in the book of Matthew before you make further commentary about this.
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No need for that as histories are written about their atrocities as well as Muslims onsalught.
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  1. :
  2. Then, what about Noah, Syuaib, Jonah and etc.They are NOT Jews you know. So, what is the problem when Muhammad, an Arab was chosen as one of the prophets?.You are reading the Bible but in your mind that the Bible only talk about the Jews.You are wrong my friend.You are totally wrong!.
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Who says so? The Arabs? Go read about them in the Old Testaments. Noah was the son of Lamech, and the tenth generation after Adam. So, do not claim what you do not understand.
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  1. :
  2. If the land cannot grow anything, how can there are still got Ethopians live there?.Nowhere in the world that no rainfall.AnD Allah said the wealth is everywhere, you have to find yourself. The earth is big AND WIDE.Since you cannot live there, then leave the place and move to other place.Who knows your wealth is not there but at other places?.You are very stupid in this.That is why Allah said you have to search!:

  3. "And when the Prayer is finished, then may ye disperse through the
  4. land, and seek of the Bounty of Allah. and celebrate the Praises of
  5. Allah often (and without stint): that ye may prosper."(Surah Al-Jumu'ah
  6. 62:10)
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Making another stupid statement. Don't you know about trible laws? One tribe cannot dwell in another tribes territory. That was how tribal laws work. You stay in your territory and I stay in mine. Further more some places in the African region there would be no rainfall for years. Looks like you do not have amy knowledge of geogaraphy and climatical conditions of the regions. Does not the Quran tell you any of these things? Oop! I'm so sorry,Mohammed only thought of the nomads of Arabia so how could he tell of people in other regions. My mistake.

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  1. :
  2. I have answered above
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Your answer is baseless.
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  1. :
  2. That is different . Because the Day Judgement will happen but not clear when.So, the best way is by repenting frequently and that is the reason Allah kept that as secret!. The best answer only God knows when the Judgement Day and the death will come.We can prophecy and calculate, the actual date or time, Only Allah Knows!.Muhammad did gave a logic answer!
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No logic? Why would a evil person worry about something that he is not sure of happening. But when one knows that for every action there is reaction and one has to pay for sins in his next life surely he would think twice before committing any sins. Morever if he still does it knowing the consequences then it must be his karma to commit and to pay the price for it.
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  1. :
  2. It is only a calculation and prophecy.You don't know the actual time.So, please repent.The guessing makes you remember  God always and you will repent always.Which will make you become a better person.Takdir..Yes it is fate of Allah.Allah already decided which time we should die, but He kept as secret, so that we can repent always.Because we doesn't know whether the death is near or not!.

  3. "Verily, all things have We created in proportion and measure."(Surah Al-Qamar 54:49)
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I know becuase many had known of their death and had taken place as calculted. My onw father was predicted to die at the age of 61 and he did die on his 61st birthday. His birth chart had foretold of his death. Wrong again. Allah did not create in proportion and measure. Child born limbless is not proportion. Cow born with 5 legs is not proportion and lately a child born in China with 3 hands is not proportion. It is all a lie and you know it and I know it but you fail to admit out of shame.
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  1. :
  2. You are talking fake..and against Islamic teaching.I am glad that I have chance to reveal it to the viewers.
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You revealed nothing but crap. Meaningless verses that contradicts and I do not find to any divine inspiration in them

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  1. :
  2. And don't tell me that the Vedas were translated by a translator only. So will you say that when you read the translated Vedas in Malay, you are going stray from the mother tounge?.So, it is translated different language by different translator, but talking about same thing.No where in Al-Quran Allah called WEAK.
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Lost your bearing? You said Islam is the true religion of GOD and that the whole world should surrender to it and its prophet. I say there is no such thing as one true religion of GOD. All religions preach good things and all religions have spiritual motivatin. Itis you who is egoistic and stuborn headed who refuse to believe in such. You thing the religion of the Arbs are more superior and that is because the Arabs have brainwashed you to think so. That is why when I chide the Arabs you get annoyed. It is very obvious and I know thatMuslims of other race have become slaves to the Arabs.
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  1. :
  2. But, that is not the Islamic teaching. So, Islam has nothing to do with what they have done. The reason that happened is because the don't follow the Scripture and the Wisdom Allah sent down.
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Now you go again with an excuse. If Islam is so strong and Allah is most powerfull why would such a thing happen to Muslims? I thought Mohammed said the Ummah would be protected at all cost because they are all believers. So, it doesn't work uh!? Sorry mate!

  1. You are not fighting?.You are fighting about faith also because your religion also has different sects.Your religion also failed to make up in to one faith, then you want to comment about the other religions..You just cannot cover that, Barney.
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Did I? have I said otherwise? Show me where I said so... Although we have different temples we do congregate at all temples. No difference to us but here you do not see Sunnis going to Shaihs Mosque. PAS has its own surau and UMNO members do not go there. PAS claim that UMNO Mosque is build in sin money. Malay Muslim would not go to an Indian Muslim's Mosque nor a Pakistani Muslim's Mosque. Too many division with race and political difference and you say Muslims are united and Islam is one. But I do not see that because we are seeing the difference. So, do not lie again.
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Post time 6-4-2007 06:39 PM | Show all posts

Reply #190 barney50's post

1)
Although it is not there directly but indirectly the clerics of Islam had instiated and groomed young Muslims to commit sucide bombing in the name of Islam and Allah. The fro such an act would be  paradise and enjoyment of the best of the best. Read this confession of a would be sucide bomber:

Would-be suicide bomber tells of quest for 'paradise'

Hainuallah's days in a destitute border village in Pakistan all seemed
exactly the same: a trip to the madrasa (religious school), the return
home, dinner, and then creeping into bed.

Of course it was boring, says the Pakistani teenager from the border
province of Waziristan.

Then one day, a preacher told him about a way out of the boredom -- a
sure ticket to a paradise filled with voluptuous virgin nymphs and milk
and honey running under fruit-laden trees.

"I came to Afghanistan to carry out a suicide attack on Americans,"
Hainuallah, who uses only one name, told an Agence France-Presse (AFP)
reporter.

"The mullah said it would earn me entry into Paradise where you live
with houris [virgin nymphs] and streams of milk and honey forever."
The dishevelled young man with a few soft hairs on his chin, wearing a
grimy traditional shalwar kamiz, was presented to AFP in an underground
cell inside the Afghan Intelligence Department in the capital, Kabul.

My answer:
See..nowhere in Islam taught about this and you finally realized that.So, if the Muslims did it, then it is against the teaching of Islam.So, the conclusion is Allah, Muhammad and Islam should not be blamed for this.Don't tell me that Hindusm are full of devotees ONLY.There must be some of the followers got Thomas faith.Between believe or not.In Islam they are called Munafik.And Munafik, InsyaAllah will be punished for what they have do.
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2)
This is an excuse to use hadith. Yes, this is the excuse Muslims use in order to use the hadith is all aspect fo Islam. Allah did not mentioed anything about any other book but it was the Muslis cleric who say so and eastrun just follow these clerics interpretation in order that Muslism would accept the hadith as word of GOD too. This is a utter lie and you are accepting lies.

My answer:
It has no excuse, but it is a command.Obey Allah and His Messenger.You see, if you can see, the verses came from different Surahs, but each of them got connection.Meaning that if you just read one part and leave another, so you won't understand.So the best way for you is to read the whole Al-Quran. And no lies.Proven by those verses from Allah.
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3)
Mohammed was told to part with the messages given by Gaberial and not  anything beside that. Muslim cleric and the caliphs aftehr the death of Mohammed created this hadith and said it is the sunnah of the prophet that all must accept and use in their daily life. So, the Quran was put a aside and the use of hadith became the comon practice of Muslims.

My answer:
I repeat...Allah sent a Scripture AND Wisdom to Muhammad.Got two things Allah gave to Muhammad.The Scripture is the leader, and as reference. Never a Muslim put the Quran aside, and Muhammad never asked the followers to put the Scripture aside.Because the Word of Allah is in the Holy Quran.The Hadith is the Wisdom that Allah has given to Muhammad.But once again, the Quran is the source of Islamic teaching.That is the common practice of Muslims.
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4)
No he did not, He only departed with messages that are stated in the Quran. He aslo said that he had made the Quran so easy to understand and so no other books would be created to explain mine. Read the Quran  again to understand its meaning.

My answer:
The verses above...in the previous thread already proved that He sent a Scripture and Wisdom.And Muhammad makes things clear with the Wisdom..so the follower can see clearly...by Physical, what Allah meant in the Scripture.This is the role of the prophets.They guide the followers with Allah permission and with the Wisdom given.Therefore I suggest you to read the Whole  Holy Quran, so that you can see the clearest picture of what Allah has sent to the prophets, not only Muhammad, but all prophets!
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5)
No, it cannot and I have given the reason. Our secular law was legislated to accomadate all irrespective of race and religion. Whereas Islamic syariah law was only meant for Muslims adopted from the nomadic culture of Arabs. It cannot be compeled on non Arabs because we are not nomadic tribes.

My answer:
Illogic answer.A law that can make you become a better person, why should you reject it?.Yes...the Syariah for Muslims. Same like the Hindusm laws..for Hindus.I also can say the laws adopted from the culture of idol worshippers which also cannot be compelled on non idol worshippers because not all of us are idol worshippers.Then why are you so worry about the Islamic laws?.
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6)
It is now slowly trying to inflitrated the non Muslim society. Anyway in Islamic countries these syariah laws are forcefully applied on non Muslim foreign workers. It may or may not be from GOD but it was meant for Muslims of Arab decendants. Just like the Jewish laws applied to Jews. Anyway, these so called GOD's law was meant for the period of time it was created and is now outdated. Passed the period of time because it does not have traffic laws, copyright act, computer frauds, security commission laws, drug laws and many more laws to come in years from now. Allah nor Mohamme did not foresee such changes in the progress of mankind in the future and so applied what was needed for that particular period. This, I think Muslims fail to see and are stuck in time.

My answer:
Where got?. Have you seen the JAIS prevent the non-Muslims commit adultery.Has JAIS punish those non-Muslims kissing in the public?.No.Then how can you say that Muslims are trying to do that?.

If you want to say that the Islamic laws are outdated, then you also need to count  that for the Hinsdusm laws which exist thousand years before Islam.But why the Hindus still use the laws, even the laws also outdated?

What ever it is, the Hindusm laws is the old laws and Muhammad brought new laws from Allah because like I said before, Allah sent the laws period by period, prophet by prophet. After Muhammad, there is no other religion to re-add or re-correct the religion laws he brought.
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Post time 6-4-2007 07:20 PM | Show all posts

Reply #191 barney50's post

7)
That is a stupid statement coming from the so called Islamic expert. As I have said earlier Islam is a religion of the desert people and living a normadic life would not know about such thing as friendship and love. Mohammed knowing how these nomadic people deal with women in their time decided to bring this laws. May be these desert people use to have sex before marriage and there were too many babies dumped around the desert. Mohammed decided to punish such people and so brought this law. May be the Arab men could not stand seeing a woman beside him. Arab men are so lustful that they cannot stay without having sex. What else a nomad would do in a desert life. So, such laws were needed to control the sexual desires of Arabs. May be eating too much camel meat and drinking camels milk had driven these Arabs to commit rape the moment the lay their eyes on young maidens. But I do not see anything wrong as long as they are true friendship and trusted love.

My answer:
That is why I asked you to open the book of Matthew in the Holy Bible, in order to confirm the existence of the law:

"And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death"(Leviticus 20:10)

And Islam confirming the law:

"If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four
(Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or God ordain for them some (other) way"(Surah An-Nisa 4:15)

but in the Bible, much stricter, because when you set a vision on a woman, you a considering commit adultery.

So, Muhammad create no law about that, because that is the law of Allah the Almighty.
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8)
No need for that as histories are written about their atrocities as well as Muslims onsalught.

My answer:
There are many Christians here...so give a try and clarify yourself.
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9)
Who says so? The Arabs? Go read about them in the Old Testaments. Noah was the son of Lamech, and the tenth generation after Adam. So, do not claim what you do not understand.

My answer:
Adam was not a Jews.Jonah was not a Jews, Noah was not a Jews, Syuaib was not a Jews.See..how many non-Jews prophets here,which Allah has chosen before.So, it is not a problem when Allah has chosen Muhammad, an Arab as a prophet.
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10)
Making another stupid statement. Don't you know about trible laws? One tribe cannot dwell in another tribes territory. That was how tribal laws work. You stay in your territory and I stay in mine. Further more some places in the African region there would be no rainfall for years. Looks like you do not have amy knowledge of geogaraphy and climatical conditions of the regions. Does not the Quran tell you any of these things? Oop! I'm so sorry,Mohammed only thought of the nomads of Arabia so how could he tell of people in other regions. My mistake.

My answer.

You are stupid.It is impossible throughout the Ethopia, there is no place to live.Some places in the Africa has no rainfall for years..Don't lie...If that is true, then there will be no living things in the places.Hem..do your scriptures talk about the Africa climate condition and etc?.Don't lie la.
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11)
No logic? Why would a evil person worry about something that he is not sure of happening. But when one knows that for every action there is reaction and one has to pay for sins in his next life surely he would think twice before committing any sins. Morever if he still does it knowing the consequences then it must be his karma to commit and to pay the price for it.

My answer:
That is why I asked you, what is the different with the Islamic law?.As I told you Muslims also believe, you will get from ALLAH from what you have done, either during your life or afterlife.That makes people become more careful.But, it is not cruel because when you commit sins, you cannot blame others, but for Karma,it is  like pouring oil in the fire.
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12)
I know becuase many had known of their death and had taken place as calculted. My onw father was predicted to die at the age of 61 and he did die on his 61st birthday. His birth chart had foretold of his death. Wrong again. Allah did not create in proportion and measure. Child born limbless is not proportion. Cow born with 5 legs is not proportion and lately a child born in China with 3 hands is not proportion. It is all a lie and you know it and I know it but you fail to admit out of shame.

My answer:
Don't just look at your father.Maybe it is your father fate, he died on such date.But have a look at other Hindus too..My neighbour, he said he will die when he reaches 27th ,but he died last year, when he did a research in the forest in Sabah.where at that time he is 23.

You misunderstood the verse. ALLAH create in measure, meaning that. When you live, at last you will die. When you are young, at last you will become old, and etc.He did all in perfect measure.And it happens.All things are not long lasting.
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13)
You revealed nothing but crap. Meaningless verses that contradicts and I do not find to any divine inspiration in them

My answer:
Because you:

"God hath set a seal on their hearts and on their hearing, and
on their eyes is a veil; great is the penalty they (incur)."Surah Al Baqarah 2:7)
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14)
Lost your bearing? You said Islam is the true religion of GOD and that the whole world should surrender to it and its prophet. I say there is no such thing as one true religion of GOD. All religions preach good things and all religions have spiritual motivatin. Itis you who is egoistic and stuborn headed who refuse to believe in such. You thing the religion of the Arbs are more superior and that is because the Arabs have brainwashed you to think so. That is why when I chide the Arabs you get annoyed. It is very obvious and I know thatMuslims of other race have become slaves to the Arabs.

My answer:
Eh!.You changed the topic my friend.Show me the verse saying that Allah is WEAK..they are talking about same things, but different choice of words.This is what happen when you tried to refuse for something that also happened in your religion
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15)
Now you go again with an excuse. If Islam is so strong and Allah is most powerfull why would such a thing happen to Muslims? I thought Mohammed said the Ummah would be protected at all cost because they are all believers. So, it doesn't work uh!? Sorry mate!

My answer:
Hek eleh..then, if you said that Hindusm is so powerful and Eternal Religion, why don't the Hindusm settled this down.Eternal religion konon!.This is fate of Allah.Have a read in the Holy Quran and may you find the answer.Ive find it and I want you to search for it, in the book of ALLAH...Al-quran..
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16)
Did I? have I said otherwise? Show me where I said so... Although we have different temples we do congregate at all temples. No difference to us but here you do not see Sunnis going to Shaihs Mosque. PAS has its own surau and UMNO members do not go there. PAS claim that UMNO Mosque is build in sin money. Malay Muslim would not go to an Indian Muslim's Mosque nor a Pakistani Muslim's Mosque. Too many division with race and political difference and you say Muslims are united and Islam is one. But I do not see that because we are seeing the difference. So, do not lie again.

My answer:
Hahaha...have a look at Mosques around you.All Muslims from all races are in one place.No division my friend.Because we are worshipping same God..that is Allah the Almighty
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 Author| Post time 6-4-2007 08:26 PM | Show all posts
Reply  #192 eastrun's post


  1. :

  2. See..nowhere in Islam taught about this and you finally realized
  3. that.So, if the Muslims did it, then it is against the teaching of
  4. Islam.So, the conclusion is Allah, Muhammad and Islam should not be
  5. blamed for this.Don't tell me that Hindusm are full of devotees
  6. ONLY.There must be some of the followers got Thomas faith.Between
  7. believe or not.In Islam they are called Munafik.And Munafik, InsyaAllah
  8. will be punished for what they have do.
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You keep saying this but do forget that the same Quran has verse such as fight the infidels, the jews are notyour friends butfriends among themselves. Do you logicaly speaking that such verse would not have any effect on Muslims and their thinking. We can see that when the leader of Hezbbolah speaks against the jews and his intentin of wiping out the Jews from the face of the earth. You mean to say the Quran and hadith did not play a part in their hatred for the Jews? You must be joking.
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  1. :

  2. It has no excuse, but it is a command.Obey Allah and His Messenger.You
  3. see, if you can see, the verses came from different Surahs, but each of
  4. them got connection.Meaning that if you just read one part and leave
  5. another, so you won't understand.So the best way for you is to read the
  6. whole Al-Quran. And no lies.Proven by those verses from Allah.
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Yes, obey Allah and his messanger who departed what Gaberial transmitted but not create another book and compel Muslims to use as reference. The so called hadith or sunnah of Moahmmed are creation of those in power after the death of Mohammed. You areignorant fo it and believed like any other Muslims that too is word of Allah. You are dead wrong and I feel sorry for you.
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  1. :

  2. I repeat...Allah sent a Scripture AND Wisdom to Muhammad.Got two things
  3. Allah gave to Muhammad.The Scripture is the leader, and as reference.
  4. Never a Muslim put the Quran aside, and Muhammad never asked the
  5. followers to put the Scripture aside.Because the Word of Allah is in
  6. the Holy Quran.The Hadith is the Wisdom that Allah has given to
  7. Muhammad.But once again, the Quran is the source of Islamic
  8. teaching.That is the common practice of Muslims.
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Say whatever you want but the truth is hadith was written by religios bigots of Islam after the death fo Mohammed. All that is mentioned in the hadith are fiction and nothing to confirm as word of GOD. If you talk about how Musims should pray and what are the time for prayers can be accepted beside that it is not worth looking at. But since Muslims consider it a sacred book I can only say this that Musims are ignorant of the fact that hadith is no word of GOD.
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  1. :

  2. The verses above...in the previous thread already proved that He sent a
  3. Scripture and Wisdom.And Muhammad makes things clear with the
  4. Wisdom..so the follower can see clearly...by Physical, what Allah meant
  5. in the Scripture.This is the role of the prophets.They guide the
  6. followers with Allah permission and with the Wisdom given.Therefore I
  7. suggest you to read the Whole  Holy Quran, so that you can see the
  8. clearest picture of what Allah has sent to the prophets, not only
  9. Muhammad, but all prophets!
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The Quran is the wisdom for Muslims but if you think the Quran has no wisdom then I have nothing to say but to agree with you
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  1. :

  2. Illogic answer.A law that can make you become a better person, why
  3. should you reject it?.Yes...the Syariah for Muslims. Same like the
  4. Hindusm laws..for Hindus.I also can say the laws adopted from the
  5. culture of idol worshippers which also cannot be compelled on non idol
  6. worshippers because not all of us are idol worshippers.Then why are you
  7. so worry about the Islamic laws?.
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  1. Did Hinduism say you must adhere to Hindu laws [ I have yet to see Hindu laws implimented in India]? Unlike Islam Hindus would undertand good and evil without any Islamic laws because the Dharma Sastras are clear about it.
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  1. :

  2. Where got?. Have you seen the JAIS prevent the non-Muslims commit
  3. adultery.Has JAIS punish those non-Muslims kissing in the
  4. public?.No.Then how can you say that Muslims are trying to do that?.



  5. If you want to say that the Islamic laws are outdated, then you also
  6. need to count  that for the Hinsdusm laws which exist thousand years
  7. before Islam.But why the Hindus still use the laws, even the laws also
  8. outdated?



  9. What ever it is, the Hindusm laws is the old laws and Muhammad brought
  10. new laws from Allah because like I said before, Allah sent the laws
  11. period by period, prophet by prophet. After Muhammad, there is no other
  12. religion to re-add or re-correct the religion laws he brought.
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Have you forgotten the recent case matter or you are ignorant of such happening? Read today's Star for more info on this. May be the paper your are reading does not wish to print such news which is the talk of the nation. But I can understand as a Muslim you are thought to brush aside such news as it involes Islam.  May be you can read about it here:  

04/04: Great risk that Sharia law might trump secular law(AsiaNews)
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Post time 6-4-2007 09:19 PM | Show all posts

Reply #194 barney50's post

1)
You keep saying this but do forget that the same Quran has verse such as fight the infidels, the jews are notyour friends butfriends among themselves. Do you logicaly speaking that such verse would not have any effect on Muslims and their thinking. We can see that when the leader of Hezbbolah speaks against the jews and his intentin of wiping out the Jews from the face of the earth. You mean to say the Quran and hadith did not play a part in their hatred for the Jews? You must be joking.

My answer:

This is what happen when you read the scripture one part and leave the others.Islam doesn't teach you to fight All Jews and Christians.But some of them only, who are trying to insult the religion. Islam taught that among the Jews and Christians, there are believers of Muhammad.But most of them not.See Allah said:

"Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah. If only the People of the Book had faith, it were best for them: among them are some who have faith, but most of them are perverted transgressors."(Surah Ali-Imran 3:110)

But in your mind Muslims are against ALL Jews and Christians.You are wrong

See the word A SECTION...

"It is the wish of A SECTION of the People of the Book to lead you astray. But they shall lead astray (Not you), but themselves, and they do not perceive!"(Surah All-Imran 3:69)

That section we have to fight.Not blindly fight ALL.And once again, I say to you.Islam never taught to fight the Jews and the Christians blindly, because some of them also has faith and accept Muhammad as a prophet.
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2)
Yes, obey Allah and his messanger who departed what Gaberial transmitted but not create another book and compel Muslims to use as reference. The so called hadith or sunnah of Moahmmed are creation of those in power after the death of Mohammed. You areignorant fo it and believed like any other Muslims that too is word of Allah. You are dead wrong and I feel sorry for you.

My answer:
Hard to explain to you when you yourself doesn't want to open the scripture and confirming with what I have told you.I told you, read the whole Scripture first before making any commentaries.See..i explained to you but cannot catch what I have explained,.The best way is, you open and read the scripture yourself.My answer are same like the previous post. No doubt the hadith is considerable but with reference of the leader (Quran)
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3)
Say whatever you want but the truth is hadith was written by religios bigots of Islam after the death fo Mohammed. All that is mentioned in the hadith are fiction and nothing to confirm as word of GOD. If you talk about how Musims should pray and what are the time for prayers can be accepted beside that it is not worth looking at. But since Muslims consider it a sacred book I can only say this that Musims are ignorant of the fact that hadith is no word of GOD.

My answer:
That shows that you are 'empty' to say that the hadith is not considerable.That is why you start insulting with the word bigot...etc.Hadith is initally from God, because Allah sent Scripture AND Wisdom.He sent two things. Initially from Him, BUT with the reference of the Holy Quran because the Scripture is the leader.I told you many times. But, still you refuse to understand.
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4)
The Quran is the wisdom for Muslims but if you think the Quran has no wisdom then I have nothing to say but to agree with you

My answer:
Did I say the Holy Quran has no Wisdom?. The Wisdom is in there, that is why it is the leader of the Wisdom that has been given to Muhammad. The Wisdom given Muhammad is to MAKE THINGS CLEAR.So that the followers can fully understand what the Holy Quran talked about.The Wisdom of Quran make the Quran a leader.That is why the Hadith refers to the Quran.

Allah Knows Best.
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5)
Did Hinduism say you must adhere to Hindu laws [ I have yet to see Hindu laws implimented in India]? Unlike Islam Hindus would undertand good and evil without any Islamic laws because the Dharma Sastras are clear about it.

My answer:
No, but, Did Muslims asked you to follow the Islamic laws?ALSO NO!.You said Islam doesn't know the evil and good because you don't read the Scripture.So, what can I say, if you still stubborn in 'kutip' small parts of the Scripture and leave the others?.That is why you don't understand.And you have to think that no religion asks the followers to do evil.Unless the religion of Satan which you have quoted to me in the previous messages:

"Did I not enjoin on you, O ye Children of Adam, that ye should not worship Satan; for that he was to you an enemy avowed?-"(Surah Yaasiin 36:60)
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6)
Have you forgotten the recent case matter or you are ignorant of such happening? Read today's Star for more info on this. May be the paper your are reading does not wish to print such news which is the talk of the nation. But I can understand as a Muslim you are thought to brush aside such news as it involes Islam.  May be you can read about it here:  

04/04: Great risk that Sharia law might trump secular law(AsiaNews)
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 Author| Post time 6-4-2007 10:18 PM | Show all posts
Reply #193 eastrun's post

  1. :
  2. That is why I asked you to open the book of Matthew in the Holy Bible, in order to confirm the existence of the law:

  3. "And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death"(Leviticus 20:10)
Copy the Code


Stoning to death is a practice of culture which was assimilated in the shariah laws as Allahs. In fact itw as practice in the Indian culture as well as the Jewish cuture. Mohammed had to take this law in order to controll his people from commiting adultry because it was more rampant in the Arab world.

  1. And Islam confirming the law:

  2. "If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four
  3. (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or God ordain for them some (other) way"(Surah An-Nisa 4:15)

  4. but in the Bible, much stricter, because when you set a vision on a woman, you a considering commit adultery.

  5. So, Muhammad create no law about that, because that is the law of Allah the Almighty.
Copy the Code


Nothing new as it was already there in ours as well ast the Jews. These are not GOD's law but traditional laws of Indians and Jews
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  1. :
  2. There are many Christians here...so give a try and clarify yourself.
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Go and google yourself for the answer.
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  1. :
  2. Adam was not a Jews.Jonah was not a Jews, Noah was not a Jews, Syuaib was not a Jews.See..how many non-Jews prophets here,which Allah has chosen before.So, it is not a problem when Allah has chosen Muhammad, an Arab as a prophet.
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I already told you they were all Jews and yet you want to be stuborn and deny it. You want to believe the Islamic clerics word then go ahead. What do I care. All I can say is you are an ignorant Muslim living in dreams.
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  1. .

  2. You are stupid.It is impossible throughout the Ethopia, there is no place to live.Some places in the Africa has no rainfall for years..Don't lie...If that is true, then there will be no living things in the places.Hem..do your scriptures talk about the Africa climate condition and etc?.Don't lie la.
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You are the most stupidest Muslim I'm meeting in this forum. Can you grow any vegetation on dry ground? People have to live because they ahev no where to go dumb head. Go to Somalia and see what is happening there? Why is UNICEF delievring water there? Study all this before you puke hee. You make me laugh lah hahahahah!!!!
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  1. :
  2. That is why I asked you, what is the different with the Islamic law?.As I told you Muslims also believe, you will get from ALLAH from what you have done, either during your life or afterlife.That makes people become more careful.But, it is not cruel because when you commit sins, you cannot blame others, but for Karma,it is  like pouring oil in the fire.
Copy the Code


There is much difference. Islamic laws are not for the current world. I have already mentioned may times about it. 1400 years ago there was no universities of higher learning to provide law studies and so the elders has to rely on traditional laws from within and others. Such time required such laws which does not explain the pros and cons of admiting your guilt or any lawyers to defend your case. It would just be a open and shut case for the elders. Something like a kangaroo court.

Yes, that was what the Islamic trial would have been during the time of Mohammed. But today there are laws legislated by body of law makers to accomadate all crimes. That is hwy I say Islamic law is outdated and passed its era. But the clerics of Islam think they are smarter and would be in par with real lawyers. But offcourse in modern times Islamic countries do their best to churn out half baked Islamic lawyers to mitigate cases related to Islamc issues only.

Sinners are destined to sin no matter how much education you give about GOD's punishment. That is because of the karmic effect upon them. No religion can change them. If it was possible why would you need then need a syariah court. Get the meaning?

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  1. :
  2. Don't just look at your father.Maybe it is your father fate, he died on such date.But have a look at other Hindus too..My neighbour, he said he will die when he reaches 27th ,but he died last year, when he did a research in the forest in Sabah.where at that time he is 23.

  3. You misunderstood the verse. ALLAH create in measure, meaning that. When you live, at last you will die. When you are young, at last you will become old, and etc.He did all in perfect measure.And it happens.All things are not long lasting.
Copy the Code


Lame excuse because your religion does not want to know the truth. The truth of dying woudl always bring fear to anyone. Your neighbour had not got his chart read for an expert, Nowadays many claim to be an expert but only few posses such quality. So do not blame astrology but the astrologer who reads your chart. As I have pointed out earlier there was no perfect measure. A baby dies in the mothers womb, is the perfect and complete? A boy grows up studies in a higher institution and before he completes he is killed in an accident, it that perfect and complete?  A child in prime age is all well and good but suddenly has high fever and becomes victim of polio, no more running around or abe to fend for itself, it that perfect and complete? Your claim is baseless without factual back up.
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  1. :
  2. Because you:

  3. "God hath set a seal on their hearts and on their hearing, and
  4. on their eyes is a veil; great is the penalty they (incur)."Surah Al Baqarah 2:7)
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Well, I can reverse that to you too but it is of no use. Let us wait and see who gets the penalty
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  1. :
  2. Eh!.You changed the topic my friend.Show me the verse saying that Allah is WEAK..they are talking about same things, but different choice of words.This is what happen when you tried to refuse for something that also happened in your religion
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My religion is not the same as yours. Our GOD do not take revenge of human beings but Asuras. It's like the GOOD against the EVIL. Anyone who creates chaos and commits artocities against human beings GOD would punish that person by way of annihilation. But your GOD Allah wants to take revenge on the very human beings he created. So there is something wrong here. Which is the true GOD? The revengeful GOD or the loving GOD? You decide.
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  1. :
  2. Hek eleh..then, if you said that Hindusm is so powerful and Eternal Religion, why don't the Hindusm settled this down.Eternal religion konon!.This is fate of Allah.Have a read in the Holy Quran and may you find the answer.Ive find it and I want you to search for it, in the book of ALLAH...Al-quran..
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You do not know the meaning of Eternal. learn about its meaning before you begin to undsertand. So now Allah has fate? Something new I'm hearing here. Fated Allah. There is no answers in the Quran but you believe it to so. The answers are al within us but you being ignorant needs to refer to Quran but yet the Quran has no answer but simply put it as Allah has kept is secret meaning Allah does not know.
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  1. :
  2. Hahaha...have a look at Mosques around you.All Muslims from all races are in one place.No division my friend.Because we are worshipping same God..that is Allah the Almighty
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In your dreams. Go to Penang and see the Khans Mosque and tel me if you can see any Malays there on Fridays. Go to Indian Muslim Mosque around the country and see if you can see any other Muslims other then Indians are there. You are so ignorant yet yo try to cover up the flaws of Islam by saying no, no, no. Suffering from the DENIAL syndrome I suppose.
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 Author| Post time 6-4-2007 11:08 PM | Show all posts
Reply  #195eastrun's post

  1. :



  2. This is what happen when you read the scripture one part and leave
  3. the others.Islam doesn't teach you to fight All Jews and Christians.But
  4. some of them only, who are trying to insult the religion. Islam taught
  5. that among the Jews and Christians, there are believers of Muhammad.But
  6. most of them not.See Allah said:

  7. "Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what
  8. is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah. If only the
  9. People of the Book had faith, it were best for them: among them are some who have faith, but most of them are perverted transgressors."(Surah Ali-Imran 3:110)

  10. But in your mind Muslims are against ALL Jews and Christians.You are wrong



  11. See the word A SECTION...

  12. "It is the wish of A SECTION of the People of the Book to lead you astray. But they shall lead astray (Not you), but themselves, and they do not perceive!"(Surah All-Imran 3:69)



  13. That section we have to fight.Not blindly fight ALL.And once again,
  14. I say to you.Islam never taught to fight the Jews and the Christians
  15. blindly, because some of them also has faith and accept Muhammad as a
  16. prophet.
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O Prophet! Urge the    believers to fight. If there are twenty steadfast amongst you, they will overcome two    hundred, and if there are be a hundred steadfast they will overcome a thousand of those    who disbelieve, because they (they disbelievers) are people who do not understand抂/i]

   
(Surat-al-Anfaal (8),    ayah 65)
  
   
慒ight against those    who believe not in Allah nor in the Last Day, nor forbid that which has been forbidden by    Allah and His Messenger and those who acknowledge not the Religion of Truth (i.e. Islam),    from among the People of the Book, until they pay the jizya with willing submission, and    feel themselves subdued.抂/i]
   
(Surat-at-Tawbah (9),    ayah 29)
  
Can you tell me what it means? In my understanding of the above your Allah is asking you to fight against those who do not believe in him.


Your excuse and verses you quoted are another pack opf lies to delude Muslims.
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  1. :

  2. Hard to explain to you when you yourself doesn't want to open the
  3. scripture and confirming with what I have told you.I told you, read the
  4. whole Scripture first before making any commentaries.See..i explained
  5. to you but cannot catch what I have explained,.The best way is, you
  6. open and read the scripture yourself.My answer are same like the
  7. previous post. No doubt the hadith is considerable but with reference
  8. of the leader (Quran)
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No, you said hadith is the Wisdom while Quran is not. That is what Muslims like you believe. The wisdom is in the hadith and not in the Quran. Allah must be laughing now or may be crying because you siad his Quran has no wisdom.
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  1. :

  2. That shows that you are 'empty' to say that the hadith is not
  3. considerable.That is why you start insulting with the word
  4. bigot...etc.Hadith is initally from God, because Allah sent Scripture
  5. AND Wisdom.He sent two things. Initially from Him, BUT with the
  6. reference of the Holy Quran because the Scripture is the leader.I told
  7. you many times. But, still you refuse to understand.
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What is leader without Wisdom? You make your own conclusion.
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  1. :

  2. Did I say the Holy Quran has no Wisdom?. The Wisdom is in there,
  3. that is why it is the leader of the Wisdom that has been given to
  4. Muhammad. The Wisdom given Muhammad is to MAKE THINGS CLEAR.So that the
  5. followers can fully understand what the Holy Quran talked about.The
  6. Wisdom of Quran make the Quran a leader.That is why the Hadith refers
  7. to the Quran.



  8. Allah Knows Best.
Copy the Code


You said it indirectly. You said Allah gave the scripture and Wisdom and the Wisdom is the hadith. I did not say it but you did. If the Quran has wisdom why would the Muslisms refer to the hadith?
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  1. :

  2. No, but, Did Muslims asked you to follow the Islamic laws?ALSO
  3. NO!.You said Islam doesn't know the evil and good because you don't
  4. read the Scripture.So, what can I say, if you still stubborn in 'kutip'
  5. small parts of the Scripture and leave the others?.That is why you
  6. don't understand.And you have to think that no religion asks the
  7. followers to do evil.Unless the religion of Satan which you have quoted
  8. to me in the previous messages:



  9. "Did I not enjoin on you, O ye Children of Adam, that ye should not worship Satan; for that he was to you an enemy avowed?-"(Surah Yaasiin 36:60)
Copy the Code


And that is why I say whoever spoke to Mohmmed was not Gaberial but something else. I Allah knowing Mohammed would be the last prophet why did not Allah personally speak to Mohammed. Why send Gaberial? There is something missing here that Muslims fail to comprehend. No, we are not children of Adam, the Arabs could accept that but not us. We are children of GOD. To us the whole of human race are childen of GOD. And we Hindus are decendant from Manu the first man. Now do you know where the word man came from? Manu-man. Think about it.
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[code]:

Thank you very much for the article. But, it only suit for the
people who reads small parts of the Al-Quran and leave others or
doesn't read the Quran at all. There are words in the article are
against with what Islam has taught.For example, the third paragraph:



"Lina Joy is a woman who was born a Muslim but who converted to
Christianity in 1998. She applied for a change to her religious status
so that 慖slam
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Post time 7-4-2007 10:09 AM | Show all posts

Reply #196 barney50's post

1)
Stoning to death is a practice of culture which was assimilated in the shariah laws as Allahs. In fact itw as practice in the Indian culture as well as the Jewish cuture. Mohammed had to take this law in order to controll his people from commiting adultry because it was more rampant in the Arab world.

My answer:
Since your laws got that kind of punishment, then why you make it as a problem when the same laws implemented in Islamic Laws?.Like I said before, Allah sent same message to every prophet, but each time new prophet come, the new prophet will restore, re add or re correct the previous laws, that is why between religions,got same laws and as well as additional laws.

I repeat:
"We have sent thee inspiration, as We sent it to Noah and the Messengers
after him: we sent inspiration to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob and the Tribes, to
Jesus, Job, Jonah, Aaron, and solomon, and to David We gave the Psalms.Of some apostles We have already told thee the story; of others We have
not;- and to Moses God spoke direct;-"(Surah an Nisa' 4:163~164)
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2)
Nothing new as it was already there in ours as well ast the Jews. These are not GOD's law but traditional laws of Indians and Jews

My answer:
Initially, all laws came from Allah the Almighty because He:

"He is the First and the Last, the Evident and the Immanent: and He has full
knowledge of all things."(Surah Al Hadiid 57:3)
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3)
Go and google yourself for the answer.

My answer:
You don't need to Google, just ask the Christians in Christian and Christianity forum.Please clarify yourself.
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4)
I already told you they were all Jews and yet you want to be stuborn and deny it. You want to believe the Islamic clerics word then go ahead. What do I care. All I can say is you are an ignorant Muslim living in dreams.

My answer:
Hek eleh...read la the Holy Bible. Adam is not a Jew, Jonah is not a Jew,please read in the book of Jonah, furthermore, your rishis also not a group of Jews, then, why are you so worry when Muhammad an Arab has been chosen by Allah to be one of His prophet?.Are you thinking that in this world, only the Jews existed from the very beginning?.So, no problem when Allah has chosen Muhammad an Arab as a prophet because there are many non-Jews prophets before him.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
5)
You are the most stupidest Muslim I'm meeting in this forum. Can you grow any vegetation on dry ground? People have to live because they ahev no where to go dumb head. Go to Somalia and see what is happening there? Why is UNICEF delievring water there? Study all this before you puke hee. You make me laugh lah hahahahah!!!!

My answer:
And you are the stupidest Hindu I have met in this forum.Like I said, if that place never got rainfall, so of course there is no living things there.There is rainfall but with season.But can you see the bright side of it?.It gave other human to do charity upon them.
But, like I said before, since you have condemned the Holy Quran just because it has no keterangan about the climate of Africa, then show me whether your scriptures got such verses telling about that or not.
What I can see is the Karma is like pouring oil in the fire...which is blaming others for evils that you have done..it is unfair and it is evil.Islam against that practice.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
6)
There is much difference. Islamic laws are not for the current world. I have already mentioned may times about it. 1400 years ago there was no universities of higher learning to provide law studies and so the elders has to rely on traditional laws from within and others. Such time required such laws which does not explain the pros and cons of admiting your guilt or any lawyers to defend your case. It would just be a open and shut case for the elders. Something like a kangaroo court.

Yes, that was what the Islamic trial would have been during the time of Mohammed. But today there are laws legislated by body of law makers to accomadate all crimes. That is hwy I say Islamic law is outdated and passed its era. But the clerics of Islam think they are smarter and would be in par with real lawyers. But offcourse in modern times Islamic countries do their best to churn out half baked Islamic lawyers to mitigate cases related to Islamc issues only.

Sinners are destined to sin no matter how much education you give about GOD's punishment. That is because of the karmic effect upon them. No religion can change them. If it was possible why would you need then need a syariah court. Get the meaning?

My answer:
That is why I said it applied only for Muslims, not for the whole races.the Islamic laws are for Muslims.The Hindusm laws for Hindus.Never the Syariah laws applied for all.Then why are you so worry about that?.Why are you so worry when Islamic laws are applied upon Muslims. It is laws of the religion, so it applies upon the followers.

Don't tell me that Hindusm laws never applied upon Hindus. Look at the way you punish the evil followers, the way you worship your Lord and etc. Aren't that included in the religion laws?.Can I ask you the same question?.Since your religion also can be said outdated, then why are you following them?.Why don't you create your own way in worshiping your Lord and etc?.Why are you following your father and mother.Why?.Because...it is your religion laws and it applies on you because you are one of the followers!.
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7)
Lame excuse because your religion does not want to know the truth. The truth of dying woudl always bring fear to anyone. Your neighbour had not got his chart read for an expert, Nowadays many claim to be an expert but only few posses such quality. So do not blame astrology but the astrologer who reads your chart. As I have pointed out earlier there was no perfect measure. A baby dies in the mothers womb, is the perfect and complete? A boy grows up studies in a higher institution and before he completes he is killed in an accident, it that perfect and complete?  A child in prime age is all well and good but suddenly has high fever and becomes victim of polio, no more running around or abe to fend for itself, it that perfect and complete? Your claim is baseless without factual back up.

My answer:
Then, how can you make sure that the one who has made prophecy upon you regarding your death is not a false astrologer?.In this case, how you want to proof that they are the true astrologer. That can give perfect prophecy.You have to be careful.Who knows the astrologer you hired also a fake astrologer who tried to be God by making prophecy about your death.Be careful!.

Regarding the verse:
"Verily, all things have We created in proportion and measure."(Surah Al-Qamar 54:49)

About the death in the wombs..so, that shows Allah has measured that the baby will only able to live in the womb.

About a boy grows up and died before he completed his study...that shows Allah has measured that he only able to live before he completed his study.

A child in prime age is all well and good but suddenly has high fever and becomes victim of polio, no more running around or abe to fend for itself, it that perfect and complete?...that shows Allah has measured that he only able to be healthy at certain time, and then he will be sick.

Got what I meant?.
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8)
Well, I can reverse that to you too but it is of no use. Let us wait and see who gets the penalty

My answer:
Ok...:

"Say: "Each one (of us) is waiting: wait ye, therefore, and soon shall ye know
who it is that is on the straight and even way, and who it is that has received
Guidance.""(Surah Thaha 50:132)

"Verily, this is the Very Truth and Certainly."(Surah Al-Waaqiah 56:95)
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Post time 7-4-2007 11:30 AM | Show all posts

Reply #196 barney50's post

9)
My religion is not the same as yours. Our GOD do not take revenge of human beings but Asuras. It's like the GOOD against the EVIL. Anyone who creates chaos and commits artocities against human beings GOD would punish that person by way of annihilation. But your GOD Allah wants to take revenge on the very human beings he created. So there is something wrong here. Which is the true GOD? The revengeful GOD or the loving GOD? You decide.

My answer:
Eh...what was the core topic ek?.I asked you to proof where in the Holy Quran saying Allah is WEAK right?.Then why are you changing the topic?.

Yes that is true...the Asuras...the Satans are Allah's enemies, that is why Allah asked we to avoid them.

"But he did lead astray a great multitude of you. Did ye not, then,
understand?" (Surah Yasiin 36:62)

That is why those who follows them and not repenting, Allah will punished them because they are:

"Doth not man see that it is We Who created him from sperm? yet behold! he
(stands forth) as an open adversary!"(Surah Yaasiin 36:77)

But Allah not blindly punish them, but Allah gives them chance to repent first:

"Know they not that God doth accept repentance from His votaries and
receives their gifts of charity, and that God is verily He, the Oft-Returning, Most
Merciful?"(Surah At-Taubah 9:104)

He is not blindly punish you. He punishes you when you yourself choose the wrong way and accept the Asuras or the Satans.

I remind you. He said:

"And that ye should worship Me, (for that) this was the Straight Way?".

He warned you, yet you choose the wrong path...then why blame Him?.
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10)
You do not know the meaning of Eternal. learn about its meaning before you begin to undsertand. So now Allah has fate? Something new I'm hearing here. Fated Allah. There is no answers in the Quran but you believe it to so. The answers are al within us but you being ignorant needs to refer to Quran but yet the Quran has no answer but simply put it as Allah has kept is secret meaning Allah does not know.

My answer:
Eternal means...yang kekal (won't vanish).Meaning that it is the religion of God because God will protect His religion from vanish by making it the top religion over other religions.Meaning that, the strongest religion is His.Allah has no fate...when I said fate of Allah...I meant Allah has 'written' the fate on that.You got me wrong.

Allah kept as secret meaning Allah doesn't know?.That meant ONLY ALLAH KNOWS.That is why it is kept the human.About why there are divisions in the religion.Quran got the answer.I have found it and I suggest you to read the scripture and may you find the answer too.

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11)
In your dreams. Go to Penang and see the Khans Mosque and tel me if you can see any Malays there on Fridays. Go to Indian Muslim Mosque around the country and see if you can see any other Muslims other then Indians are there. You are so ignorant yet yo try to cover up the flaws of Islam by saying no, no, no. Suffering from the DENIAL syndrome I suppose.

My answer:
You yourself never went to mosque and have a look in it...so how can you talk about this?. Never in the Islamic teaching saying that when you are Indian, you have to go this mosque and when you are Malay, you have to go this mosque.Never!. We all gather in one mosque.Go to the mosque and have a look.
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12)
O Prophet! Urge the    believers to fight. If there are twenty steadfast amongst you, they will overcome two    hundred, and if there are be a hundred steadfast they will overcome a thousand of those    who disbelieve, because they (they disbelievers) are people who do not understand
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Post time 7-4-2007 11:31 AM | Show all posts

Sambungan

Thus, according to the Qur'an, as a result of the advent of the Messenger of God in the Banu Ishmael, those who rejected faith from amongst the polytheists were subject to the death penalty, under the provisions of the Divine Law relating to the advent of God's messengers.

http://understanding-islam.com/r ... article&aid=241

It is not me who is saying it but Muslim clerics. May be you are using a differnt Quran from those who interprete from their Quran.

My answer:

Can you tell me who is Moiz Amjad...the author of the article?. I don't think so he is a scholar.

He is an author.The best answer is:

"But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards
peace, and trust in God: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things)"(Surah Al-anfaal 8:61)

Go to www.islamonline.net....full of scholars there.
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17)
Please do not talk rott. He had already denounce Islam under statutory declaration. That is proof enough to show that he had renounced Islam. If his case had been take to the civil courts o fthe country I'm pretty sure the syraiah court would lose its case. Knowing it very well the syariah court withdrew its claim and handed back his body to the family. And as for Lina Joy, she need not go to syariah court to file her case as she is a citizen of Malaysia and Federal Constitution she is under the juridction of the civil courts. The Judgement by the appeals court is pending because the civil court does not want to offend the syariah court and is under negotiation. Soon it would be in her favour and she can officially marry her fiance in the church. Her appeal is based of the rights of an individual citizen and not as a Muslim. Get that inot your think headlah.

My answer:
Because they are Muslims then the laws applied upon them.So, it clear  enough that the laws not blindly applied upon others.But those who are Muslims or ex-Muslims, for sure the laws are applied upon them.
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