Hudud passed law
Date :- 20/03/2015Source :- The Sun (and major other newspapers).
ALL 44 Kelantan state reps including 12 from UMNO VOTE IN FAVOUR of amendments,All 44 assemblymen - 31 from PAS, 12 from UMNO and one from PKR - voted in favor of the Syariah Criminal Code (II) 1993 (Amendment 2015) Bill.
In an immediate reaction, MCA president Datuk Seri Liow Tiong Lai speaking at a press conference after a meeting of Barisan Nasional leaders in Kuala Lumpur said an official statement on BN's stand on hudud will be issued soon by Prime Minister Datuk Seri Najib Abdul Razak.
Meanwhile Selangor Menteri Besar Mohamed Azmin Ali who is also PKR deputy president said hudud is not part of Pakatan Rakyat's common policies even though Muslims have an obligation to support Islamic criminal code.
i would urged the moderator to merge this topic to my topic on huduh....as this forummer flooding theforum
thank u:) It seems that the Flood Warning was not enough for these stubborn Muslims and their daydream of turning this country into another Muslim third world cesspool. :huffy
Very well, I pray to God that before END of THIS Year, Kelantan will be no more. May God send Flood and violent winds that will tear through the state, sending these Muslims into the hills where they starve to death. May hardship and suffering comes to those who tries to help them like they did during the Flood last time.
Truth.8 replied at 20-3-2015 10:41 AM
i would urged the moderator to merge this topic to my topic on huduh....as this forummer flooding th ...
What you speak in your Hudud thread is very different from what I speak here.
In your hudud thread, you are asking a question whether it is relevant or not at present time. In this thread, I'm talking about the Hudud system already being passed in Kelantan at this moment. Two different topic.
Source :
http://www.nst.com.my/node/77508
https://hornbillunleashed.wordpress.com/2015/03/21/bar-hudud-shows-ktans-disregard-for-constitution/
http://www.thestar.com.my/News/Nation/2014/05/03/Hudud-against-Federal-Constitution/
With so many people (including MIC - didn't knew they had balls) agreeing that Hudud is AGAINST the Constitution of Malaysia, the question here could be - "What will be the action(s) taken by the Federal Government regarding this?"
So far, Federal Government seems to be reluctant to open its mouth. They said Najib will give an official statement regarding Hudud soon but it have been days and it is quite surprising why it is taking Najib this long to open his mouth.Actually, it is not surprising at all.
The BN is now in a turmoil on what to do. They had repeatedly requested PAS not to implement any Arab circus called Hudud in Malaysia as Malaysia is (or should be called was) a multi-racial country and Hudud is suitable ONLY IN SINGLE RACE COUNTRY like Pakistan, Bangladesh, Indonesia, Africa and Arab nations.
However, if BN were to support PAS and Hudud, it will draw the wrath of its component parties as they could see UMNO's action as an action of a stray dog licking its own excrete after years of fighting against PAS. IF they do not support PAS and Hudud however, it will draw the wrath of their Muslim members, especially the hardcore types like Perkasa and ISMA who could currently daydreaming of becoming Taliban-wannabees, to help reinforce Hudud nationwide. Law and Order could shift from the Police (which consists of various races) to these groups (which consists of a single Muslim race) to uphold Hudud in Kelantan (and as PAS daydream comes - nation wide in the future). The Constitution and the Legislative Branch of the Government will lose its hold on the Country and the Country itself will slide down to chaos.
Therefore, it is Lose-Lose situation for BN. No matter which side they support (or decline to support), it will be a bad news for BN. And to make things worse, there are hardliners within BN itself who wants to see Hudud implemented. They could be very happy now believing that Hudud will be implemented in Kelantan which will act as a role model for other states which will accept it in later time. By rejecting Hudud, BN WILL draw their wrath as well.
So, BN has a choice to make first - will it serve as a leader of a multi-race country, OR will it choose to satisfy only ONE race and incur the wrath of others, an in process break Malaysia apart? We will watch and see Najib's decision.
On the personal note :- Tambah lagi satu masalah, lagi Nipis lah jadi rambut atas kepala Najib. {:1_530:} Elaine Xian Xian
March 21 at 11:50am · Edited ·
Hudud, Qisas, Ta'zir. Understand it before make any statement about Islam law cruel. Hudud tdk kejam. Yang kejam hanya manusia. Jika you nampak 1 negara itu lakukan hudud kejam, itu dari pemimpin tdk adil & tdk amanah. And remember that, that is not hudud. Itu cuma hukuman manusia yang mengaku hudud. Please understand it & jangan tertipu. Especially for my non Muslim friends. I tegaskan, hudud tdk kejam. That's why we must understand what is hudud? What is Qisas? What is Ta'zir? For Muslim, hudud itu penting & pelaksana hudud pun penting. I'm people who's support hudud. Kerana i nampak undang2 ini adil dengan kajian i. And congratulation again to Kelantan. May God ease everything. Everything will become smoothly with full of bless.
https://www.facebook.com/apple.clancy.7/posts/568720966563773 obelisk replied at 23-3-2015 09:55 AM
Elaine Xian Xian
March 21 at 11:50am · Edited ·
Bull$hit from a Prostitute who doesn't know $hit about Hudud. {:1_567:}
Go and educate yourself before you open that mouth of yours. Here's some links for you to read. IF you cannot read (or have intelligent enough to understand), find someone who has intelligent to explain it to you.
Source :
http://cilisos.my/7-non-muslim-kelantanese-tell-us-what-they-think-about-hudud/
- Some questions asked by ignorant non-Muslims who do not understand the bigger picture. They kept thinking that Hudud is just like Common Laws where the Public can make opinions about its laws. They do not understand that many of the laws in Hudud is based on Al Quran and they cannot be changed - not even by Muslims themselves. Furthermore, the final goal of Islam itself is to convert and conquer ALL NON-MUSLIMS - either through fear or through manipulation. Hudud is just ONE of those tools.
https://vulcanpost.my/165108/top-10-things-didnt-know-hudud-law/
- TOP 10 things you do not know about Hudud laws.
http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malaysia/article/dont-exempt-non-muslims-from-hudud-muslim-scholars-suggest
- STOP believing in bull$hit that Muslims will respect your (non-Muslims') rights to be exempted by Hudud. WHY? Cos it will cause an unfair situation between Muslim and non-Muslims.
Imagine a Muslim caught stealing and got his hand chopped off. Then a non-Muslim got caught stealing also but given several years of prison and comes out with all his limbs still intact. Do you think Muslim who had his hand chopped off will be happy looking at the non-Muslim who still has his limbs even so the crime are the same? Therefore, sooner or later, Muslims WILL try to push the Hudud down non-Muslims' throat as well and they will do it without asking our (non-Muslims') opinion about it.
Therefore - there will be no exemption in Hudud for Muslims and non-Muslims. It may exist now but in the future, there will be no exemption.
Mesia ni satu hari nanti akan jadi macam Arabia - jika malaun2 fanatik terhadap sesebuah ideoloji teros dibenarkan membuat kepotosan, dasar dan memegang kuasa. Mr_Beruk replied at 23-3-2015 12:35 PM
Mesia ni satu hari nanti akan jadi macam Arabia - jika malaun2 fanatik terhadap sesebuah ideoloji te ...
Mimpi je lah bahawa Malaysia akan menjadi spt Arab Saudi. Sebelum itu, kaum bukan Islam akan bangun naik menentang. Peperangan saudara akan berlaku dan Malaysia tidak akan wujud sama sekali.
Dari abu peperangan ini, maka akan wujud negara baru yg tak ada institusi Raja yg seakan pondan, Menteri dan ketua menteri yg dilantik hanya berdasarkan kaum dan agama serta agama Islam yg menjadi batu penghalang terhadap kemajuan manusia. Orang Melayu akan menjadi kaum gasar dlm hutan ataupun kaum seakan dayak laut di Sulu dan Riau sana.
Orang Islam harus ingat SATU benda je - Orang bukan Islam tidak bangun menentang secara kekerasan adalah kerana COMMON LAWS dan Constution negara ini SAHAJA. BUKAN kerana takutkan Islam ataupun orang Islam ataupun tuhan karut mereka, Allah.
Hudud can create an unlawful/unfair situation.
I'm not sure whether you have read the links I have provide above (Post #7 - Top 10 you don't know about Hudud) but there are a few things there which could make this law unfair to many. There are :-
Furthermore, the witnesses can and only be male Muslim adults. That means women cannot be a witness.
Therefore there is a limitation toward witnesses which a prosecutor can bring into a court room. The witness MUST be a male MUSLIM adult (I will assume this means anyone who is above 16 years old) and he must be a Muslim and he must be a male.
Which means a rapist can enter a female dormitory and before a group of women, rape one of them and walk away and none of these women can be called a witness because they are women.
Same goes for a thief who enters a house, kills the parents and robs the place and even if the child/children were to witness these act and able to identify the culprit, there is no room in Hudud for them to be called a witness because they are children.
What sort of Criminal Laws is Hudud where it can specify what sort of person can become a witness? In Common Laws, unless a person is proven to be mentally and physically incapable of providing proof or account of what had happened, ANYONE can become a witness to a crime. Will there be any amendment on this flaw of Hudud System, I wonder?
It’s called a Diyat. The victim or Wali is allowed to pardon the offender by means of monetary compensation. The rich will definitely be in a better position by using monetary compensation to escape the worst of qisas punishment such as death, while the poor will almost always have no option.
I think the explanation is not required as it shown what Diyat is clearly.
This means that the punishment will be determined by the state’s law or at the court’s discretion. Ta’zir punishment for crime not measuring up to the strict requirements of hadd punishments, although they are of the same nature, or those for which specific punishments have not been fixed by the Quran.
Here is a funny thing. If the Court cannot prove someone is guilty, by default it means that the person is innocent. At least that is what Common laws stated. But not in Hudud it seems. In Hudud, it appears that anyone who is charged with a crime but the crime itself is not proven is considered GUILTY with Ta'zir status.
Physical or circumstantial evidence is not accepted in hudud.
In Hudud, it seems that the only "evidence" is that which comes from witness who must be a adult male Muslim. If the Hudud court throws out physical and circumstantial evidence (which what used most in order to show a person guilty or not), then how will a criminal be prosecuted?
Rapists will walk free if they rape someone and then kill his victim and the only evidence we have are the physical evidence (like semen, blood and hair sample) but these are thrown out by Hudud Laws.
In a recent amendment of hudud law, they had recently dropped lesbians intercourse, necrophilia and bestiality as crimes.
I thought under Islam, ANY actions which result in Sexual action other than that which committed between two married couples are considered zina (adultery). Which brings us to the question - by what logic did they dropped the above act (as non-adultery)? {:1_515:} Source : http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malaysia/article/ridhuan-tee-dares-hudud-opponents-mca-gerakan-to-exit-bn
KUALA LUMPUR, March 23 — Controversial lecturer Dr Ridhuan Tee Abdullah has challenged Barisan Nasional (BN) components MCA and Gerakan to follow through on their threats to quit the ruling coalition over the hudud issue.
In his column in Malay news portal Sinar Online, Tee also mocked the two parties as only surviving on the “charity” of the Malay voters and of no benefit to Umno.
“Earlier on they have threatened to exit parties, if there are Malay parties that supports hudud. Please do so if you dare,” wrote the Universiti Sultan Zainal Abidin lecturer.
“As it is, Gerakan and MCA does not profit Umno. Instead Umno had to sacrifice Malay majority seats to give way to them. Who profited, who lost?”
Maybe it is about time for MCA, MIC and Gerakan to stop supporting UMNO and leave. They had lost majority of their voters (from their own racial group) in the past because they kept holding onto UMNO, believing that UMNO alone could able to save them. This allowed UMNO to do anything it want, including placing rascist pig like Riduan Tee here into its fold. Not to mention ISMA and PERKASA also.
So it is about time non-Muslim/Malay parties to exit UMNO and BN. Let the Malays to stand alone. Give them no support in term of social and economy. Still no responds from the Federal Government
Suprisingly there have been no announcement by Putrajaya about the Hudud laws which were passed in Kelantan State recently. One of the known tactics Putrajaya like to use is "Wait and See" tactic, where Putrajaya will hide and watch how things goes everytime a crisis appears. They did that in MH370 crisis and MH17 crisis and now, they are doing it as well for this crisis as well. Because as I had said before - this is a Lost-Lost Situation for BN. No matter which direction they turn (whether they support or don't support), they will likely to get in group later.
It is also possible that the Government is currently viewing the views of its collation parties which makes up BN. UMNO alone cannot possibly survive this as majority of UMNO members are Muslims and many of them support Hudud like a blind cow lead to the pastures (or the slaughter house). MCA and MIC already put their feets down by decline to support the Hudud movement. DAP ready to fight and many of the Malays (especially the more sensible and intelligent educated group) seems to put their feet down and stated that they do not support Hudud as well. Perhaps UMNO is still calculating how many people which supports or reject Hudud, create a percentage and support the ones which has the most majority. In another word - "Lalang" tactic.
There is one possible way how Putrajaya can save the day though, but it will not be easy. They can also announce that the Kelantan State had no judiscation to implement Hudud (which is true as no single state have any Judiscation power to override the Federal Court) and move to take over Kelantan by the powers of Parlimen and the Court. In another word, declare Darurat in Kelantan, move the military in and arrest all those who had implemented Hudud with the charge of treason. Then dissolve Kelantan State government and form a new state election once the situation had settled down.
And to prevent the same fiasco from being repeated in the future, Putrajaya should BAN PAS as a political party because it had extended its power beyond that which was allowed for a political party by initializing Hudud movement. This can be done. Parti Komunis Malaya and Semangat 46 are two example of parties which had been banned before, WHY NOT PAS? Question here is - will Putrajaya do what must be done for the greater good?
Source : http://www.thesundaily.my/news/1367227
Posted on 27 March 2015 - 12:37am
Last updated on 27 March 2015 - 12:53am
PETALING JAYA: After a long silence, PAS president Datuk Seri Abdul Hadi Awang has come forward to provide an explanation to the public on the controversy surrounding the planned implementation of hudud in Kelantan.
In an open letter posted on his Facebook page, Abdul Hadi questioned Muslims who had repeatedly given excuses against the implementation of hudud, by using Islamic terms to justify their excuses."In discussing heavy issues, it is improper if one wants to act like a parrot that can only repeat words taught by its master … without understanding the meaning," he said.He said hudud is easily targeted by critics because many thought that the punishments based on Islamic law are violent.But he cited civil laws which prescribed "outdated" punishments such as hanging to death and whipping.Abdul Hadi said the private member's bill proposed by PAS is not a hudud bill, but amendments to the Syariah Courts Act (Criminal Jurisdiction) 1965, which is only applicable to Muslims."We are knowledgeable, civilised and mature beings. Therefore, listen first to what we are proposing," he said."Don't just jump to conclusions and criticise without knowing the whole story," he added.A lot of big words for a small fellow. He accuses those who fighting against Hudud as parrots who repeats words taught by its master WHEN HE AND HIS PAS FELLOWS DOING THE SAME THING - REPEATING THE WORDS AND DEEDS DONE BY MUHAMMAD AND THE ARABS. Look at yourself before you can judge others, Hadi. You and your kinds are WORSE then us. At least with our deeds, we can give you explaination on why we do something. You on the other hand can only come out with nonsense like "Muhammad said so."
Civil laws are outdated he says ... Oi, Hadi .... lu ada pergi sekolah kah? {:1_567:}
Civil Laws we have today is about 300 years old, Islamic Syariah Laws is about 1,400 years old. Which one older? Which one more outdated?
We are not talking about whipping or hanging here, we are talking about chopping a person's hand or stone women to death like dogs in the street. You (Hadi) show the audience how many MEN had been stoned to death for adultery the way women had been stoned even today in backwatered and barbaric nations like Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Bangladesh etc.
Only applicable to Muslims you say. BULL$HIT and you know it. Sooner or later, only this idiotic 7th century nonsense get foothold in Malaysia, you could want to expand it to non-Muslims because IT WILL BE UNFAIR for only Muslims to lose their hands or feet or their lives for the same offense non-muslims commit. Muslims themselves will feel unfairly treated and will push for Hudud to be implemented. IT IS INEVITABLE THAT MUSLIMS WILL TRY TO IMPLEMENT HUDUD TO NON-MUSLIMS.
Knowledgable, civilised and mature being you say. Then come out with a guideline on how to use Hudud. Starting with legal procedure such as what Police should be doing, what lawyers should be doing, what Acts should the prosecutors should use for what offense and what form of defense and rights does the offenders has in Hudud laws. Come out with basic implementation of Hudud and show it for the public instead of calling yourself knowledgeable and accuse others of being less-knowledged.
Source : http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malaysia/article/dap-can-lose-penang-without-pas-claims-kelantan-deputy-mb
UALA LUMPUR, March 26 — The DAP can lose Penang in the next general election if PAS is no longer its Pakatan Rakyat (PR) ally, a top official from the Islamist party has said.
Kelantan Deputy Mentri Besar Datuk Mohd Amar Nik Abdullah told Umno-owned daily Utusan Malaysia yesterday that the DAP needs PAS to get Malay votes.
“If there is a split in the opposition pact, DAP will lose out,” Amar was quoted saying.
“It is unsure whether can defend Penang if PAS is not in the opposition pact. Don’t think only PAS depends on others, other people also depend on PAS in the pact,” he added.
PAS, however, won just one state seat in Penang in the 13th general election to DAP’s 19. PKR had won 10 seats, leading to PR controlling 30 seats in the 40-seat legislative assembly.
The Penang chief minister is Lim Guan Eng from the DAP.
“We need each other. That is why I said, DAP and PKR must act wisely. If they make a wrong move, everybody lose,” Amar said.
Sounds like PAS is panicking over DAP's ball move to stop working with PAS over the Hudud Issue. If only DAP did that, PAS couldn't be so afraid but the equally brave moves by MIC and MCA to speak out against support Hudud (even if UMNO did support it) had made PAS question whether they could remain in power after the next general election.
It is no surprise that many in UMNO do not want Hudud to be implemented in Malaysia even so they do not speak out openly. Even Dr. Mahathir himself had stated Hudud System is not for Malaysia. None of the BN's former leaders had ever spoke of supporting Hudud, making it PAS's sole daydream for the past two decade.
PAS's popularity kept reducing over the years due to its inability to bring modernization to states which its controlled thus relying heavily on Federal Government's assistance in this matter. In the last two general election, we could say that PAS won because of two factors :-
1. Support from PKR and DAP.
2. People's dissatisfaction toward BN.
However, leaders of PAS like Hadi came to a conclusion that people support PAS because they wanted Islamic rule. They believe they could use Islam as a leverage to push people to support them blindly, bring implementation of Syariah and Hudud into play and eventually curb the growing influence of non-Muslims in the country, thus cementing the Malay influence over the general population.
A daydream which many Malay supremists like ISMA and Perkasa and many inside UMNO secretly and openly support, which leads to PAS coming out with Hudud System. Why else could a party which challenged the Constitution directly have not been banned and its leaders arrested? Why else could BN - the ruling party of the Government kept quiet like an ostrich sticking its head into the sands and pretending the problem doesn't exist?
In my opinion, PAS have been in the endangered list for very long time. And now with the death of its formidable leader, Tok Nik Aziz and the new, relative untested leader, Hadi in the helm, it seems that PAS is heading toward its own destruction. In the next general election, it is possible that no one will support PAS. Source : http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysia/article/pas-man-slams-emotional-comments-on-social-media-not-helping-hudud-explanat
He said ethics were not observed by most social media users when posting comments on the issue.What ethic he said not being observed by social media users which he claimed? He is referrring to "BFMKupas" video clip? If just one clip, it is hardly fair to justify all or even half the social media are not being ethical about Hudud.
The offences, Mujahid said, were stated in several parts – the first being hudud offences from the shariah perspective according to the Al-Quran and Sunnah – theft (sariqah), robbery with use of violence (hirabah), adultery (zina), sodomy (liwat), accusing another Muslim of adultery or sodomy without four witnesses (qazaf), a husband's sworn allegation of adultery against his wife without supplying witnesses (Al-li'an), alcohol consumption (syurb) and apostasy (irtidad or riddah).
"I want to give a true picture of what this is about... As a Muslim, I am responsible to inform the people that shariah is a complete law. It cannot be without a punishment system," Mujahid said, adding that retribution might come in two ways.
One law which has two retribution - One for the Rich and Powerful (so they can use their money effectively) and another for regular people who are lacking in power or money.
I think he forgot to mention what the punishment for those who committed Apostasy are. Because as far as I know, leaving Islam means Death Sentence in Islamic Laws.
On the views that Malaysia was not ready for the shariah criminal law due to lack of awareness, understanding and conducive environment, he said the penal code and traffic regulations too were implemented without the people having full knowledge about them. Hello ... Have you heard of Driving Schools, Moron? {:1_567:}
The public were taught about Penal Code and Traffic regulations in regular schools and driving schools. By the time a student reaches Form 4 - 6 (age between 17 to 19), he had given basic instruction about traffic regulations and human rights. Just because your bangsa are like bangsat tak bersekolah, that does not mean that everyone in Malaysia do not know Penal Code or Traffic regulations.
But same cannot be said about Hudud. Which school teaches Hudud Penal Code? Which Ustaz teach the public about Muslim rights, procedures, regulations and punishment on Islamic laws? Where are the books on these subjects? Where are the discussions between Islamic scholars being held on Islamic laws and how to implement them? All we have are PAS daydreamers who are working hard to turn Malaysia into MalaySial. {:1_541:}
But same cannot be said about Hudud. Which school teaches Hudud Penal Code? Which Ustaz teach the public about Muslim rights, procedures, regulations and punishment on Islamic laws? Where are the books on these subjects? Where are the discussions between Islamic scholars being held on Islamic laws and how to implement them? All we have are PAS daydreamers who are working hard to turn Malaysia into MalaySial.Ni kena tanya tohan sendiri ni che'gu.. tanya oustad, scfoolars bukan ta' boley, tapi mereka pon cuma ejen2 bawahan skim MLM ketohanan je, takda direct contact dgn tohan. Elok tohan sundiri yang beri penerangan since idea ni datang dari-nya.. calling for god..
Mr_Beruk replied at 31-3-2015 07:28 PM
Ni kena tanya tohan sendiri ni che'gu.. tanya oustad, scfoolars bukan ta' boley, tapi mereka pon cum ...
PAS dan mereka2 sebulu dgn mereka fikir senang je utk mereka melaksanakan hudud. Luluskan di Dewan Rakyat dan Dewan Perundangan, dapat mengiktirafan dari setengah pak Arab ciplak sini dan Malaysia sudah ada Hudud. Akal mereka hanya sampai sana je.
Bab perlaksanaan Hudud sbg sebuah Undang2, prosedur dlm benda2 praktik setiap hari, kakitangan bertauliah serta berilmu dlm hal Hudud semua ini TAK ADA YANG FIKIRKAN - termasuk si Hadi dan lebai2 kambing dalam PAS. Malahan tak ada pula saya dengar hukuman apa yg akan dijatuhkan kpd kakitangan kerajaan yg mengambil rasuah ataupun lalai dlm tugas mereka.
Pernah juga saya tanya apa hukumnya sekiranya seorang hakim menjatuhkan hukum bunuh kpd seorang pesalah, pesalah itu mati dihukum dan kemudian didapati dia tidak bersalah. Apakah si hakim itu bersalah dan boleh dihukum dlm Hudud ke atau tidak? Tak ada jawapan. Saya pernah tanya juga kalau seseorang itu dihukum pancung tangan, dan kemudian didapati tidak bersalah - apa yg akan terjadi nanti? Adakah si hakim, orang yg melaksanakan hukuman ataupun lawyer yg akan dihukum pancung tangan juga? Tak ada jawapan.
Semua tak ada jawapan tetapi orang Islam dan Pak lebai kambing PAS asyik menyalak kononnya Hudud itu hukum tuhan. Apasal hukum tuhan kau macam tak sempurna je? {:1_567:}
sir, i feel your dissatisfaction about this matter but try to absorb the fact that hukum had or hudud is a body of a holy law itself. and in any of the islamic feqah laws regarding "pembahasan hukum" ( i dont know in english, in feqah its called mawdhu'), there's a presence of a hukum wad'ie (hukum ketentuan) before the law commenced. i would say, it is very very very very difficult to prosecute anyone with hudud charges.
1500 years had passed, and we should be alarmed only 4 people had breech hudud law. only one had died of stoning, but with her own confession. even the one that had been punished, run away from it and never being apprehended again to complete it.
sir, sorry for my bad english command. im not a cleric btw.
ijan_jenin replied at 1-4-2015 09:33 AM
sir, i feel your dissatisfaction about this matter but try to absorb the fact that hukum had or hudu ...
u being nice in writing..very polite....but remember we have some devil uses dirty words to counter attacked your views...u need bestrong with such words comes from this particular person...personally i feel he/she comes frm problem family...{:1_539:}
Truth.8 replied at 1-4-2015 10:18 AM
u being nice in writing..very polite....but remember we have some devil uses dirty words to counte ...
im just a small potato...btw i would like to ask you sir if i may, what is hudud from your understanding of it?
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